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MystBunny

About Dragoneer...

*sigh*... I'm truly sorry if this journal upsets anyone. I'm going to try my best to speak my mind while still showing some measure of respect. I hope it's enough, but if it's not, know that I'm not holding anything against anyone who has fond memories of Dragoneer personally. I know this isn't a black and white issue, and I have no doubt that on a personal level, Dragoneer may have touched certain peoples' lives positively. While many of you know I had no shortage of animosity towards him and what he did, if he were standing in the path of an 18-wheeler, I'd have pulled him off of the street if I had the chance.

So no, this is not a "good riddance" journal. If anything, it's unfortunate he won't have the chance to rebuild some of the bridges he burned. I'm making this journal because a lot of you weren't around during the worst of the cub panic on FA, and many people remember Dragoneer as someone who "brought the fandom together", which might have been true in the beginning, but then all of that was undone by his hand, and many lives were turned upside down while he and the filth that moderated that site at the time ignored, or at worst perpetuated it without remorse or consequence.

You can make all the excuses you want about why the cub ban happened in the first place (many of such ever-changing stories have been debunked, however), but what happened AFTER the ban was absolutely inexcusable.

Imagine Twitter antis times 10. That was the hellscape of FA after the cub ban. A dear friend of mine and respected cub artist here on Inkbunny has hidden his past identity since 2009. He was doxxed, threatened, and blackmailed into leaving FA while trying to stay and follow the new rules. Many cub artists and enthusiasts experienced the same or similar. Blackmail, threats, doxxing, harassment, just a wave of hatred (that also spilled over into Twitter) for people who drew or commissioned the wrong arrangement pixels on a screen, and those whose automatic biochemistry responded to it.

So what did Dragoneer and his mods do about it? Ban people who spoke out against the abuse. People were suffering waves of hate and abuse, threats, and doxxing, things that should have been worthy of action by Neer and the mods, but they sat back and allowed the abuse to go on, and on, and on, and on, and when someone got tired of it all and lashed out, THAT is when action was taken, not against the abusers, but against the abused.

Yes, I'm still sore about the ban itself, but everything that happened after that could have been dealt with, and wasn't. Not with any other content ban have we ever seen anything on this level before or since. Not even cub bans on many other furry sites have degraded into anything like this. All of this has created a wound in the furry fandom that has never truly healed.

There's a lot more I could go into. The fraudulent donation drive, punishing and publicly shaming two people trying to shine light on legitimate rape threats (which including doxxing the address of the victim), continuing to ban people over personal beefs, etc., but the waves of the hate that was coddled since the cub ban are still being felt by all of us 15 years later, with no effort being taken to undo or even mitigate the damage.

So no, I wouldn't wish what happened to Dragoneer on anyone, and I don't hold anything against anyone who remembers him in a positive light, but the damage he caused should not be overlooked. It should be remembered along with him, never forgotten, and most importantly, never repeated.
Viewed: 296 times
Added: 3 months ago
 
peanuts
3 months ago
Honestly, as much as I totally respect the good that Dragoneer brought into the world, I think this is incredibly important to remember too. It's always sad when someone dies, but that doesn't erase the ongoing cub situation or the struggling of everyone affected.
MystBunny
3 months ago
Exactly. I would argue that the good may have come about in spite of him, because of the people who came together and welcomed each other in the beginning, and didn't throw a tantrum about differences in taste, but admittedly that was before I started paying attention, so it's just speculation. He did do a nice journal about how he would never ban cub porn but... well...
babybunnydiapercute
3 months ago
I agree with the post above, THINK HOW MANY ARTISTS WERE HARMED BY HIS RULES 😡😡, you can hate me and block me, but I will not respect him for being a terrible example of a moderator, I only feel sorry for his family and friends for his death, BUT NOT FOR HAVING BEEN A MODERATOR ON FURAFFINITY 😡😡
MystBunny
3 months ago
Artists took the brunt of it, because they were so visible, but it wasn't just them. The antis were emboldened and left to run rampant as they do on twitter today. They aimed to hurt anyone they could in any way they could, and they were allowed to do it without limit.
babybunnydiapercute
3 months ago
Yup , and agree with the opinion of those who were harmed by him in furaffinity and the truth will hurt, dragonner destroyed and ruined the dreams and hard work of many artists and WILL NEVER BE REMEMBERED, for his mismanagement in furaffinity, and those who were always on his side and didn't like what I said can block me and accept reality.
Varwulf
3 months ago
You really did hit the nail on the head with this one. I think like with most things, there is a good side and a dark side to the person behind it, and we can be sad that another person has passed on way too young while also having a mixture of feelings about that person as a whole.
MystBunny
3 months ago
I mean there's nothing wrong with choosing to focus on the positive, but when the person has done so much irreversible harm, that positivity can be uncomfortable as well, especially if it disregards the truth in such a way that seems to brush aside the pain many of us felt as a direct result of those inexcusable actions. I mean again, I'm not holding it against anyone for doing that, and I'm not going to tell them they can't or shouldn't, but it doesn't make my feelings any less valid.
Varwulf
3 months ago
100%.
Acehole
3 months ago
I just heard on discord.
He was a nasty person and a man child.

He refused to see reason and would never admit he was wrong. He played favourites on the site letting some get away with murder and banning other people over nothing.
He messed up fur fright for everyone and was banned from every major con due to the trouble he caused.
And there was rumour about him being a map which is why his wife left him and jumped in bed with one of the FA admin.
He ran FA into the ground with his poor leadership.


Neer has hurt a lot of people over the years and few will feel pity about his passing.
I'm not going to poke fun and laugh, that's in poor taste but I've highlighted his crimes instead before anyone feels too sorry for him.
Varwulf
3 months ago
I also heard rumors about the map stuff, and perhaps something about him protecting another admin for actually using FA as a means to seek out minors for such activities on the site. I also heard plenty of rumors (and was subjected to it, on a minor level) of him playing favoritism on the site as well, as you describe.

I don't see that mentioned that much, so I am glad you brought it up.
MystBunny
3 months ago
I've heard those rumors as well, but I wasn't following them. I believe them, but for this journal I just wanted to stick with what I saw for myself.
Acehole
3 months ago
He also protected a rapist who used FA to stalk women. He told the victim not to go to the police. After the cub ban the site got hacked and all his PM's leaked.
It also turned out a friend of his was having sex with real life animals and told Neer about it in great detail.
Both are crimes by law he should've reported instead of covering up. FA nearly got shut down for that.
MystBunny
3 months ago
" He also protected a rapist who used FA to stalk women. He told the victim not to go to the police. After the cub ban the site got hacked and all his PM's leaked.


Yes, he did tell her not to go to the police or to go public with it, but I don't think we have enough solid information on this one to declare the other person guilty, especially since a jury who had more information than we did found him innocent.
Acehole
3 months ago
The rapist who I won't name had a history of it and that wasn't his first time. But Neer protected him due to being on the staff.
The women begged Neer to do something as he was stalking her on FA still even after the rape. By the time the police knew about this the trail was cold and there was little proof left apart from Neer's own PM.
MystBunny
3 months ago
I do feel sorry for him. Both for his passing and the trouble he's caused for himself. But yeah, he was into cub, and there are still some rapey cub commissions with his character floating around, and that makes the betrayal all the worse. He hurt people who didn't judge him for his kinks, and on the other end, many antis hate him. Because of what he was into before, they just couldn't take the win.
Acehole
3 months ago
I don't feel sorry for him, he was a bully and a bad person. I'm on about real children not cub with Neer.
He can no longer hurt others or drag the fandom through the mud.

I'm not happy he's dead but I'm not sad either.
MystBunny
3 months ago
That's fine. I'm not exactly shedding any tears for him myself, but I don't think there was much more damage he could have done either, apart from doubling down on Digimon.
Acehole
3 months ago
Few people will miss him, Most will just go through the motions so they don't get trolled.
GreenReaper
3 months ago
No rumours on such matters, please. Frankly, bringing up reasons for relationships falling apart is also poor taste.
DownThePipes
3 months ago
I have a such mixed feelings on him but this moment is just too sad
MystBunny
3 months ago
Understandable.
DownThePipes
3 months ago
it just makes me wonder what will happen to FA heard talks it might actually be shut down
MystBunny
3 months ago
THAT would make me happy. But I don't think it's going to happen.
GreenReaper
3 months ago
It could mean a fair number of the people there would come here, but that's not necessarily a good thing at that volume.
MystBunny
3 months ago
I can see where that would cause some issues, but I can at least rest easy that if they whine about cub here they won't get their way like they did on FA.
Balmung
3 months ago
I'd plan for it just in case. Sadly it turns out that a lot of such things depend on a single person with no transition plan, and so it could well suddenly go offline without a warning, as soon as bills stop getting paid.
moyomongoose
3 months ago
Especially not a good thing if that large volume coming over after FA goes down start a relentless battle trying to force IB's upload policy conform to the former rules of what FA was.
MystBunny
3 months ago
That part I'm not worried about. They may start a shit-storm, but they won't get their way and probably leave for Twitter.
DownThePipes
3 months ago
that would not be a good thing too many artists still depend on that site if anything I would like it to go back to the way it used to be before they screwed it up badly
MystBunny
3 months ago
I suppose, but I doubt there's any mod there that could or would get it back to that.
DownThePipes
3 months ago
I'm trying to find some optimism in this misery
CFC
CFC
3 months ago
i read it here and there not the full thing and i get the just of it and i do agree to this i was around at this time
MystBunny
3 months ago
What really sucked for me, is that I didn't have internet at home for a long while before the ban, and just as I got it back, the shit hit the fan. I had just finished HMOE as well.
SenGrisane
3 months ago
I was not outward harassed for the cub stuff. The mods just poked until I had a permaban.
They found stuff in my gallery almost a decade old and gave me a strike. And then another. And then another. etc.

And strangely they only ever found one infringing image at the time. With just enough time in between to slowly work up the strikes to a permanent ban. Even after I stopped uploading they kept going.
MystBunny
3 months ago
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't they say at one point that they were only going to DELETE content posted before the ban, and not take action on it otherwise?
SenGrisane
3 months ago
Yes they did. They must have dropped the rule a few years later.
TwoTails
3 months ago
Geez people.
A flawed to bad person perhaps, but I learned not to assume trust in hearsay.
If the bad is true then he was the same as like half the other people on this damned planet.
I try to give the benefit of the doubt that some unpopular actions were forced by funding pressures they couldn't creatively solve.
I've only had a few run ins with some ditzy mods there, so I don't have much of a grudge with FA, just disappointment.

But the main overwhelming issue is that it's said he died from disgusting negligent greed in this counties medical industry in which I have been experiencing & screaming about for over a decade.
I mean people should feel some sympathy for him on that part at least.
TwoTails
3 months ago
I'll have to reiterate* that I significantly doubt much of the bad things said about dragoneer, I'll consider it but nothing more, so nor want more stories.
*Because increasingly for years been having issues with people trying to only see things not said, whatever the term, chronically offended or something.
Acehole
3 months ago
To GreenReaper I am sorry about that. I will not talk about such matters openly again. Bad form as you pointed out.
Karmandel
3 months ago
De mortuis nil nisi bonum dicendum est. I think everybody who wanted to know about Dragoneer's antecedents will have informed themselves before this happened. And if nobody has anything good to say, that speaks a lot too.
MystBunny
3 months ago
I don't agree with the philosophy that only good things must be said. The harm he did, I think was substantial enough that it should not be forgotten, and we should remember it if indeed FA goes down and more furry sites pop up, or more people come here stirring shit up about cub porn. I don't want anyone to have to go through those terrible events again.
MystBunny
3 months ago
" If the bad is true then he was the same as like half the other people on this damned planet.

I don't know if half the people in this world would stand for the level of abuse that he did, but if that's true, that speaks more to the state of the world than him.

" I try to give the benefit of the doubt that some unpopular actions were forced by funding pressures they couldn't creatively solve.

I have nothing against that philosophy, but this is all about what came after that, and you may not have been subject to the worst of it, but it did happen.

" But the main overwhelming issue is that it's said he died from disgusting negligent greed in this counties medical industry in which I have been experiencing & screaming about for over a decade.

I'm behind you on this one. 100% I don't wanna hear this "how do we pay for it" crap when we've given blank checks to contractors and corporations without a second glance, and less wealthy countries somehow found a way to pay for it while the "greatest country in the world" is somehow always just too poor when this subject comes up.

edit:
TwoTails
TwoTails
sorry, didn't reply
Naruque
3 months ago
I hope that when my exit date arrives, that people wait at least a few days before bringing up everything I have done wrong in this live. Lord knows I have been far from perfect, but just reading a lot of negative thing here and it kinda hits me that a lot of folks are more focused on the bad things than the good.

I think we could do better, or at least give it 48 hours to let those that dont want to throw shade, to grieve some.

Just my opinion, I am likely wrong for having it
MystBunny
3 months ago
Well what brought this about was that I feel some people are being positive to a point they're saying things I don't feel are entirely true. I just feel that the harm he did is significant enough that it shouldn't be overlooked or brushed aside. I mean if someone was just mean to people who didn't deserve it, I think I would have kept my thoughts to myself, but this goes well beyond that. What he did affected all of us and still does 15 years later.
MystBunny
3 months ago
To be clear, I do regret leaving a comment on someone else's journal to that effect, for the reason you mentioned, but my journal I don't, because we're still going to be feeling the effects of his actions many years later.
Rougebuddy
3 months ago
I don't consider myself a 100% furry so I am not aware of what you are referring to, but as I understand it.
That Dragoneer guy was a furaffinity moderator right?
And apparently furaffinity moderation turned to shit after the cub art block.
And Dragoneer is dead now?
Was he murdered?
Please, ignore my first comment, my english sucks and I didn't understand correctly
MystBunny
3 months ago
No, no, he died from Covid complications and our healthcare system being shit. I'll delete the duplicate comment. Dragoneer was the admin for furaffinity. Cub was allowed there at first, but for whatever reason, he decided to ban it. After that, the antis got emboldened and started harassing, doxxing, threatening, blackmailing, etc without consequence, forcing out people who accepted and started following the new rules while the mods ignored the abuse except to help force out cub artists and enthusiasts whenever they had an excuse.
Rougebuddy
3 months ago
Well, then I didn't fail so badly in interpreting it.
And wow, he passed away from covid?
I really doubt that the salid system is as deplorable as the one here in Latin America, lol.
Every time I hear news about furaffinity I get more convinced that by choosing this site, I made the right choice.
And well... a death is a death, it will never be a reason to celebrate, at least in my opinion.
Who knows, maybe if he survived he could change for the better, hope is the last thing we lose.
MystBunny
3 months ago
Definitely the right choice. I came here once things got out of control there, but even just basic policy, not having mods being obsessed with the perceivable age of a fictional character is a big plus. Most recently, FA doubled down, clarifying that Digimon that look too young are banned, and Renemon is acceptable even though she's technically cub, because she's tall, and Gatomon, who is technically adult, is banned, because she's short. Though that doesn't explain Gabumon who is cub AND short, but he's fine too apparently. Just creating a bigger mess for themselves.
Rougebuddy
3 months ago
What nonsense, if they care about age or maturity, literally a debate would rage for every post, drawing, or character they post
Even in pokemon there can be pokemons that have been around for more than 50 years and are level 10, or are still in their initial stage.
Even that would generate debates
KrisProwler
3 months ago
You may not want to say it but I will. The man and anyone else that is willing to aid and abet that kind of abuse is a cancer upon society and we're all better off with him dead.
MystBunny
3 months ago
mmh, yeah I won't go that far. We've been dealing with the aftermath for 15 years, but the damage has already been done. His death doesn't make that any better.
GreenReaper
3 months ago
I think he was just trying to do what he thought was right to keep FA online, with viable staffing, etc. And it has stayed up, mostly, despite all the valid criticisms about some of the ideals it left behind on the way. At least that is worth some recognition. I didn't directly experience much of what has been talked of here so I can't really speak to those particular aspects.
SpoonFox
3 months ago
He was a victim of trauma and abuse from those around him, and people decide to take their frustrations out on him. He was never inherently evil, misguided at times definitely, but he did what he felt was right. The people who abused him surrounded him, and those same people are the ones who might be in control of FA now. That is more important. As a friend who stepped down as admin and left FA said, "Neer gets bullied and pressured to do shit he doesn't agree with. I can't be in that environment anymore."

But people always want to burn others, not knowing what fights they're going through in the background.

Seeing some of these comments in this journal makes me incredibly sad... What has our fandom become. I'll return to watching.

I wish people would stop spreading lies and misinformation. It won't happen... *sigh*
babybunnydiapercute
3 months ago
The good side is that many artists who were harmed by him and his rotten moderation on Furaffinity will celebrate 🙂, pretend that I am a professional artist and I make art instead, then I make a funny innocent art of the baby looney tunes with baby daffy duck pulling baby bugs bunny's diaper, making him embarrassed in front of his friends by hiding his penis with his hands, BUT THE ROTTEN MODERATION OF FURRAFINTY COMMANDED BY DRAGONNER PUNISHES YOU BY SAYING THAT THE DRAWING ALLUDES TO CUBS PORNOGRAPHY 😡😡😡, I'm not surprised that many have left the place so as not to be unfairly banned.
MarcusKoopa
3 months ago
Ding dong, the hypocrite's dead. I probably still HAVE some of his cub art in my old porn directory.
ZwolfJareAlt306
3 months ago
100% there was controversy about Dragoneer, but even so, I have never been happy when someone has died. Especially the way he died; I would not wish that on anybody.
MystBunny
3 months ago
Yeah same. Not happy about the damage he did, but not happy he died this way either.
FoxTanukiBoy
3 months ago
Jabba the Hutt.
Felt
3 months ago
I'll save my mourning for the passing of people I actually know and care about.
MystBunny
3 months ago
I tried to know him before the cub ban, but didn't get very far. If I'd gotten to know him, holy shit would I have torn into him while all of that was going down, to the point where he probably would have banned me too.
UrianKitsune
3 months ago
1. Don't accuse me of something I have not done. THAT is gaslighting. His comment is still up and we all have eyes, we can read, and it is pushing policy with the death of a figurehead. That IS political.

2. Don't even bother responding to me as I'm leaving after I clear the air with this comment. Trying to censor me won't shut me up. Lack of interest will, and I certainly have better things to do with my time.

Toodles.
MystBunny
3 months ago
I'll reply once at least. You've misunderstood, so I'll clear things up for myself as well.

" DO NOT use a man's death to promote your politics, Proxy. It makes you look like a monster.


This is what I was referring to as gaslighting, not the other stuff. And yes, it was political, but my first comment on the subject was that our healthcare system is shit. Kepora responded, then Proxy responded to him. Proxy was simply weighing in on an already ongoing discussion. It seemed like a good faith discussion to me on all sides, and I felt it was entirely relevant. I was gathering info to respond to Kepora when you came in with the communist/socialist stuff and I'm just very tired of that kind of thing, and it would have turned this journal into a shit-show. I'm also not in the habit of censoring. I've left up all the comments. As you said, everyone can see it, and my block list still stands at 0. On the rare occasions I have blocked someone, I've unblocked them shortly after. Cooler heads and all that.
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