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RoareyRaccoon

Jailbird

So another artist leaves the fandom, bullied over cub content. Obviously can't show Jailbird, because they left, but fuck the individual case, let's just get to brass tacks and cut out all the noise, shall we?

Why are so many of my fellow artists such pussies? Why do almost all of you keep your fucking mouths shut when others are getting screwed over? Do you simply hope you can keep your head down, keep making money, and with luck the mob won't come for you? Doesn't work that way, you absolute cowards. People who get a kick out of ending someone else's livelihood will FIND a reason to identify new targets, find new things that are "offenses" worthy of taking, from you, everything you've worked for.

But hey, you keep quiet and let the environment get worse until everything all of us have built for years is ruined. Fuck yourselves. All you can do is run or keep silent; you make me sick. Alternatively, you could rediscover your spines and actually stand your ground. There's a thought, eh?
Viewed: 841 times
Added: 2 years, 5 months ago
 
BlazeHeartPanther
2 years, 5 months ago
If anything, that guy that Bloodhawk recently ratted out should be the one cancelled considering that he has made contact and is in a relationship with a minor XP
mudpaws
2 years, 5 months ago
I've been waring people about this sorta thing for a very long time now, all I ever heard is oh just store it they are just little kids and so , people quit the fandom, and there's all the lies a crap about us furs , all that needs to stop , I love all art  and if people don't like it tuff stuff,.
BubbleGlass
2 years, 5 months ago
I've almost given up, if i didn't have such good friends and loving partners i would have been one of those pussies for sure. I've been called a pedo for just drawing things i want to draw and that's it. Or even supporting my friends through my art. I am not going to stop though. I will make sure everyone gets to see it. Your art and others like it have been always here to tell me i'm not alone <3
Ainoko
2 years, 5 months ago
There are some people on FA *cough* TEIL  *cough* that makes it their mission to out people who do cub art and making unsubstantiated claims that if someone does cub art means that you either are a pedo or will be, if you do gore art you will kill somebody and so one with all types of art and only want to see plain vanilla art. TEIL  and their ilk have even forced FurNation to disallow any and all cub art less than a year after the site went live. I would not be surprised that they are targeting anyone who does cub art, commissions cub art etc to get them to leave the fandom.

I agree with
BlazeHeartPanther
BlazeHeartPanther
that actual pedos need to be outed and banished. Should we do out, shame and banish zoophiles, people who take payments for commission and vanish, diaper furs who wear used diapers and leave used diapers in convention venues?
RoareyRaccoon
2 years, 5 months ago
Their only power, and of those like them, is one's consent to have them govern what is right and wrong.
Ainoko
2 years, 5 months ago
I agree. I don't know the extent of TEIL's army of rabid drones is, but it's big enough to cause mayhem.
FlyingToasterJay
2 years, 5 months ago
Why do you lump diaperfurs with animal rapists and scammers?
It took me a bit (writing a whole bit in defence of the large majority of diaperfurs) to realize you meant *just* the ones who do this. The phrasing is rather poor and I recommend you refine it.
They do deserve to be outed, much like "Mr.BLFC Hallway Cum Pizza Dude/Cumming For Cancer Cunt"
Otherwise if not then the actions of a small group will define the whole group. You've no idea how many people believe rainfurrest is just how all furries are. Internet historian forget to add one thing to the video that he really should have and it's that most if not all of the guests there were banned from every other con; if not most public spaces.
Yiffox
2 years, 5 months ago
I am definitely not for pedo art.  IMO thats adult on cub stuff.  Ive never had a problem with established characters being sexualized, say wilykit from thundercats, mainly cuz I drew porn of him when I was a teen, among others.

That being said,I cant stand pedophilia, to the point that I wouldnt even watch a movie lately called good boys which sexualized unwitting children to make sexual jokes only adults would know.  It's disgusting, even though I have a passing reference to it, where older sisters were sexually abused as children.

As far as FA goes, I took a stand back in 2010 when they started saying "teen" characters could not be depicted having sex.  The main focus then was sonic because he was said to be 16.  First thats a really old hedgehog.  see my point?
DiogenesShandor
2 years, 5 months ago
People really need to stop using Fur Affinity
LongTom
2 years, 5 months ago
I'm only still there because people I know are still there and use the website the most.  The irony is that FA was taken back by its original founder, who is reportedly very woke.  I can understand someone being scared of allowing anything that might be construed as pedophilia on their website, and as the old saw goes, if you own the press, you can control what is printed on it.
Wolfblade
2 years, 5 months ago
Links to this person leading cancel charges? Just curious.

Ainoko
2 years, 5 months ago
I stand corrected, it was Tartii that was behind furry network (not furnation) disallowing cub art on the site...

Source: https://en.wikifur.com/wiki/Furry_Network_(art_archive)
Wolfblade
2 years, 1 month ago
There's the name I recognize, and yeah, that was the person most responsible for pressuring them into that bullshit bit of theater they put on to try and pretend like they were just doing what the users wanted.

It was lies.

And I'll never stop saying so.

Narse specifically asked me to attend their reveal announcement at BLFC that year, and asked for my input on the whole cub issue.

As he presented to me face to face that time, they'd all already considered the matter from every angle, legal and otherwise, and had basically come to the conclusion I was telling them was the only sane one:

The only position is NO position. Your terms say nothing illegal, and AT THAT TIME, not even the laws that won't survive a single challenge in court (which is why they have not been the basis for prosecution of anyone but ONE man who is a special case of inept counsel) applied to fantasy animal things. Let people who are gonna bitch, bitch, and ignore them. Nobody threatening "I won't use your site unless you banish anyone I don't like" will actually follow through on the threat if your site is actually good, and the few who WOULD actually stick to those words aren't anyone anybody should want to appease anyway.

They recognized and understood and agreed with all of that when it was a discussion about principles and reasonable expectations.

Then career shitfit-creators threaten them and they fucking buckle.

Either she had dirt on them or they just pussied out. Doesn't make much difference to me. I've had my fill of promoting a site just for them to make a liar of me after the fact.
Roketsune
2 years ago
Doesn't Teil have bewares on them for unfulfilled commissions (I believe Jailbird does as well, actually)?

Also, I think you're confusing FurNation with FurryNetwork. FurNation's founding was like 20-25 years ago. FurryNetwork had a cub porn furor like you mentioned in 2016, but FurNation I think had lost any real relevance before Teil even became a furry.
ShinySteenee
2 years, 5 months ago
Damn. Another day, another artist gets harassed over fictional drawings.
AuraPupArts
2 years, 5 months ago
Haven't they left numerous times? Maybe I'm thinking of somebody else but in these cases such artists within furry always slither back in.
RoareyRaccoon
2 years, 5 months ago
Don't care, honestly, the retreat itself is a moral failing.
AuraPupArts
2 years, 5 months ago
Absolutely. Considering potential implications however - what with comparisons to real imagery by normies - it's best to lay low and let the upset calm down than stand ground and end up in a worse off position. Furries are rabid when they want to be (be best if they directed it towards worthwhile subjects in this day and age obviously..) and I think most would rathar not deal with them.
LongTom
2 years, 5 months ago
I know you (and others) got kicked off FurAffinity for having the wrong political views, which is why I opened an Inkbunny account when I learned you were here.  I don't talk politics on FA or DA anyway, nor do most people.  I only do it here because I can do so without harassment, and you're someone who can give very good arguments.
UrianKitsune
2 years, 5 months ago
Pissing into the wind here, bud. I share your sentiment and have been outspoken about this before most people realized it was a thing. Those of us willing to speak out are far too few in number for meaningful results. Until the mob comes for them they won't pull their head out of the sand.
Yiffox
2 years, 5 months ago
not really...there was mass exodus from FA when they did cub thing, and another when sonic thing in 2010s...then they pulled back...FA now?  I would guess its all run by woke weirdos
LongTom
2 years, 5 months ago
While I don't always agree with you, I lifted my earlier block on you out of principle.  I still don't believe Bill Cosby is an innocent victim though, so please no debate over that.
moyomongoose
2 years, 5 months ago
It seems anyone could make an issue out of anything. And there are those who do.

One example...Just because I posted the story linked below doesn't make me a war monger.

"The Day Jed Coyote and Rex Coyote Beat Up Two Hippies"
A lot of it is about what Jed Coyote and Rex Coyote experienced while serving in the Vietnam War.
MviluUatusun
2 years, 5 months ago
Every time I hear about this situation, I'm reminded of this poem written by Pastor Martin Niemöller while he was in a Nazi prison back in the 1930s:

First they came for the Communists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Communist
Then they came for the Socialists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Socialist
Then they came for the trade unionists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a trade unionist
Then they came for the Jews
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Jew
Then they came for me
And there was no one left
To speak out for me.
LongTom
2 years, 5 months ago
That poem is just a platitude.  Few people speak out for those they disagree with.
MviluUatusun
2 years, 5 months ago
I do.  I believe wholeheartedly in the saying from the 1960s, "I may not agree with what you're saying but, I will defend to the death your right to say it."  Too many people these days want to silence those that disagree with them calling it "Hate Speech".  I actually got blocked by an artist because he didn't realize that I was defending his right to say something that might not be popular.
Zenobius
2 years, 5 months ago
It always baffles me how quickly people just want to ban and censor others just because their art makes them "uncomfortable" or "upsets / disgusts" them, not realizing that these are the same tactics the literal Nazi's used (1938's book burnings + removing "degenerate art" > https://www.britannica.com/art/degenerate-art ) and what the later Comic's (and Hay's) Code tried to do to remove "undesirable artwork that might be an attack on our decency / children". And these people will support it whole-heartedly because "their censorship is for wholesome purposes" (i.e. the 'greater good')... that is until their own cronies come knocking on their door and when they finally realize what a grave mistake they just made, that's usually when it's 'too late'.

The age old saying of: "You don't know what you have until it's taken away from you." and this is why I will always defend freedom of speech.
ZwolfJareAlt306
2 years, 5 months ago
Agreed; art is not abuse!
Wolfblade
2 years, 5 months ago
With very rare exception, people I have spoken to who have actually taken my advice to make sure they throw their balls onto the table and just fucking stand firm that they will draw what they're gonna draw and anyone with a problem can fucking leave -

have all had the same experience:

A brief period of a bunch of noise as people try to screech them into backing down - and a number of followers/watchers leaving -

followed by an increase in new watchers far outnumbering those that left, and a change of tone among their audience as people who understand the difference between fiction and reality applaud their firm stance and encourage them to do their thing, even if it's not always something that particular audience member personally wants to see.

The atmosphere around you will improve the moment you fumigate for the poisonous rats that will join one of these mobs from inside your audience and try to pressure you into caving too, or flip you into the fire to save themselves if you don't.

The anti-cub shit has always been something MOST people in furry couldn't give a shit about.

The exception to all of the above currently is just the trans umbrella. The only trans people I have interacted with personally have been perfectly lovely and rational human beings, but there's this cloud of toxic virtue-signalling lunatics that envision themselves as saviors of the oppressed who go around doing endless evil and damage and hate in the name of protecting someone else who doesn't need their fucking villainous shit being pinned on the people they're supposedly wanting to signal their ally-ship with.

I originally had no issue drawing alternative configurations of genitals or gender identifiers when asked, but the venomous toxicity around the subject is why I just don't take any work that would be placed anywhere in the gender-non-conforming ranges. I'm not going anywhere no matter how much anyone screeches, but I also just don't have the time for the headache.

I would love to see some return to what this fandom used to be, but it can not happen until a platform exists where the people in the big chairs refuse to flinch or comply with ANYONE using any bullshit to declare "you're making me feel unwelcome by NOT making THOSE PEOPLE unwelcome."

People can either co-exist and deal with the fact that not everyone will get along, so some people just need to keep to their side of the room -
 
or people can just go for each others' throats to see who destroys who first, because that's the only option left to anyone when ANYBODY is being permitted to act that way with little to no opposition.
BogdanUrs
2 years, 5 months ago
" followed by an increase in new watchers far outnumbering those that left, and a change of tone among their audience as people who understand the difference between fiction and reality applaud their firm stance and encourage them to do their thing, even if it's not always something that particular audience member personally wants to see.


exactly - if only he stuck around he would have gained a whole new audience and even new friends who would be even more true than the ones that turned their bakc on him
BogdanUrs
2 years, 5 months ago
in the end nobody cancelled JB - he cancelled himself

on one hand i feel sorry for him because he was being bullied. but instead of saying "fuck u i do whatever i want" and then doing just that, he pulled down his gallery and cancelled himself which i call cowardice

not angry at him (not much anyway lol) - just disappointed
GreenPika
2 years, 5 months ago
Am probably going to get hammered for saying this BUT, I will answer your question: People don't speak up in general because society is a horde of sheep and bullies. Yes even a lot of "good" people like yourself and others. Like when the pandemic started and I pointed out 99.9% survival rate ain't worth killing small business over. Like when I pointed out, vaccines require 5 years of testing FOR A GOOD reason, not 5 months. Everyone and their dog in this fandom crucified me for daring speak up. Yall called me an "anti vaxxer" over a single rushed vaccine. Now I'm being proven correct in my initial warnings about the covid shots/lock-downs but most are ignoring that.

SO WHY WOULD ANYONE EVER KEEP THEIR MOUTH SHUT?! maybe because in this society, one's "friends" are 3 wrong words away from being your moral enemies and some of us know we will get fucked by all sides if we dare open our mouths.  

My heart goes out for all those who get intimidated into giving up. I will remind you ALL though, that you are part of the social system that allows this kind of shit as the norm. It effects all aspects of life, not just some random artist running away from IB. Yall stand by while government and media turn cub art into "real life CP charges". Just like people stand by while elections are stolen, defensive w3apons taken away from the people and taxation without proper representation rules. No one is allowed to defend themselves anymore, lest they get targeted, if not by the government, by their friends. :/
RoareyRaccoon
2 years, 5 months ago
There are countless reasons to be a coward, none of them prevent cowardice from being cowardice. I know all too well what the consequences of speaking are, the loss of friendships and reputation. Principles test friendships, so standing up for them will inform you of how worthy those bonds were to begin with. It's usually much harder to do the right thing, which is why so few do it.
GreenPika
2 years, 5 months ago
I fought tooth and nail, stood up even when I was the weakest in the crowd. Standing alone on a mountain, I now see so few around. Was the point to simply die knowing I took the hard path? Would I have been better staying asleep? All I find are the whispers of the wind, telling me about an amazing future, that no body below wants.

If the world doesn't want to crash and burn, the normies need to start the climb.  
RoareyRaccoon
2 years, 5 months ago
Doing the right thing isn't about having a positive outcome, avoiding negative outcomes are the reason people don't act, but they are not justifications. Telling the truth and standing for something that matters isn't about happiness or profit, never was.
GreenPika
2 years, 5 months ago
Unless you believe in the afterlife, what's the point if not to set forth a change in the world? Many say, regardless if you believe in heaven and hell, if a few do the right thing, the subconscious of mankind picks up on it and will eventually follow. 12 m0nk3ys phenomenon or something.  
babybunnydiapercute
2 years, 5 months ago
this topic reminded me of the boring side of the furry abdl fandom that hates fictional art porn cubs in diapers, it's the prejudice against adult arts sexy ageplay DL , an example that happened to me 4 years ago , I lost a friendship in a furry Facebook group , just because I like the comic boy's night in by the artist colt3n , and the ignorant idiot knew and hated the story of two adult abdl friends who find themselves in the abdl, then he kept calling me a disgusting perverted bastard and that he didn't deserve to be part of the abdl furry fandom for liking this story 😠😠, in short, I pretended it didn't exist and blocked it, in good terms it's one thing, but there are a lot of people who take furry abdl cuteness too seriously to the point of discriminating for no reason and not even giving a damn to the luxury of studying the subject before judging, and thus humanity walks towards the road of ignorance and lack of information.
elPatrixF
2 years, 5 months ago
I think they just realize it's not a fight worth fighting for if the few people they lose for standing up are more important than the few more randos they please including themself. I'm myself struggling to figure out what to do because I'm in constant fear that I'm doing the wrong thing by being into stuff like cub. I think it's sad but what else are you supposed to do when you lack a spine and can't fight for what you like if you're not even sure what you like is ok?
RoareyRaccoon
2 years, 5 months ago
Yeah, people coming to the conclusion that standing up for moral principles just aren't worth it are fucking arseholes, there's no excusing it.
TravisCoon
2 years, 5 months ago
I followed Jailbird since I went to FA. Never saw any cub porn in her artwork, I'll miss her art.
punishedmob
2 years, 5 months ago
I did get kicked off Twitter the moment I was starting to do some numbers, haven't been able to find a way back. I just make fun of these cultists, mostly. I will be forever perplexed by the collective effort to protect the human rights of pixels on screens and lines on paper. It was never this bad even 10 years ago. I also keep seeing some people who draw shota/loli/cub who let themselves get upset by the mob. I'll never get that. I really like Izzy's art, that lady who was doxxed out of animation, but I see her fighting with these people and getting upset all the time. I keep wanting to find a way back onto Twitter and just chime in like "You can't keep letting these people drive you into a depression spiral."

But it's gotten so bad I seriously saw someone recently arguing that people who like pregnancy art (nonspecific) are pedos. The wailing and outbursts over anything even remotely anime drives some people into freakish panic and ban brigades. It's nuts in a certifiably insane way.
RoareyRaccoon
2 years, 5 months ago
You'll never get why a legion of people calling you every vile thing under the sun is upsetting? Don't be bloody stupid.
punishedmob
2 years, 5 months ago
Of course I know why it can be upsetting. I've been called every vile thing under the sun since I was a kid. I'm just saying letting them get you to self destruct over it isn't the way to respond.
Roketsune
2 years ago
Izzy? That furry porn artist? She was doxed out of a job in animation?
kst3xh
2 years, 5 months ago
Holy shit, 41 comments and more that I  actually read! THIS RIGHT HERE is what I like to see! A real journal and some real discussions and Points of Views being shared! This gives me hope. If I could as others once told me...I'd totally fave this post.
Sentient36
2 years, 5 months ago
Sigh...another artist I happened to follow at FA for some time, gone. =(
Gao
Gao
2 years, 5 months ago
Looks has long since retired from FA. Since then I have hardly seen any art from her. Too bad that she goes. :(
DevilKrin
2 years, 5 months ago
Hell, I didn't even know Jailbird did cub content until now. Shows how much I paid attention. XD;
Roketsune
2 years ago
I didn't either... I remember some shitfest years ago when they had posted Rick and Morty porn/erotica, which was somewhat aggravated by the fact they were doing personal stuff like that while so many commissions were outstanding. I don't recall anything beyond them doing smut of the aforementioned 14 year old cartoon character.
Roketsune
2 years ago
Dear God, I'm actually finding I agree with you on some things. Sometimes your inflexible and reactionary bellicosity is actually endearing! I've always responded to this sort of cowardice and pandering with immense contempt.

Also, wait... Jailbird left the fandom?

Also, wait... Jailbird drew cub porn? I knew they drew some Rick and Morty stuff that pissed off the libs on Twatter, years ago. They were doing cub? Like, on Inkbunny?

In any event, I don't know whether they had corrected the matter and made amends, but Jailbird I believe has had a history of not completing commissions. That might be the main factor in their departure.

Roketsune
2 years ago
I found this illuminating.  https://en.wikifur.com/wiki/Jailbird

One of your assertions in this journal- the reasoning/catalyst for her departure- was at best incomplete, at worst totally inaccurate. The hardcore cub/shota stuff might have been the catalyst for her nuking her FA and IB and Baraag, but people were upset with her in her FA shouts for other reasons before that revelation. Looking at the archives of her FA page, while there was some outrage over the Mastodon cub porn discovery (which seems to have been greatly amplified by the fact she has children, an argument I am slightly sympathetic to but still reject), the main overall complaint is she habitually fails to do commissions and is an account jumper. She has had problems for possibly over a decade. I'm seeing something on the order of 250-500 commissions that were outstanding. She evidently came to Inkbunny and took commissions after promising to not take on more commissions on FA.

The other and underlying assertion- that she left furrydom- is also erroneous. My main proof of this is her Picarto account is active, with a video posted yesterday. She is quite active there.

Furthermore, while she did delete her FA (and her Inkbunny and Baraag), she recreated her FA account with the same name and much of the same profile, but has no submissions. The new Jailbird claimed to not be her and just wanted the name, but much of the profile in the old one was directly copy-pasted into the profile of the new one. The profile doesn't serve any other purpose than to direct people to her accounts, and the FA account in general has no discernible activity or function. That this is just some rando who took the name and helpfully copy-pasted links to her still-existing sites/accounts and doesn't want to do anything else with it isn't plausible.

You should investigate more thoroughly before riling up your audience, you doofus.
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