Inkbunny

How is it not fair? You sold a character for $10.00 and received $10.00. If it was worth more than that, the only person who's screwed you over is you for underselling.

AeylinFaith

7 years, 6 months ago

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Edited 7 years, 6 months ago by Owner

Okay so imagine I'm buying like, I don't know, a chair, for $10 in the store, I used it sat on it for like 2 years, it's "old" and yet I sell it as "new/used" to someone else, for $10. That doesn't make sence right, now.. that is not really a big deal, it's a cheap chair, but lets say it's a couch, $600.

You still think it's fair if I where to sell that for $600?

I didn't have to make the coach, I didn't have to "work for it" other then getting the monney to buy it, and yet here I am selling it for the same price or more, after having used it, and enjoying it for all this time.

This is not some kind of product to buy a lot of and sell from product, this is not some retail like vegetables and fruits..

fibs

7 years, 6 months ago

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No. It would be patently illegal because you lied about the condition of a physical good.

Fictional characters are not physical goods. Concepts such as "used" and "theft" do not apply to intangible property, which is why they have their own set of copyright & infringement laws.

Mickey Mouse was first created in 1928. If Disney suffered an infectious parasite that made it make horrible decisions and sold Mickey Mouse, do you think he would be worth less than he was 90 years ago?

AeylinFaith

7 years, 6 months ago

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So your okay that someone buys a character, and art and enjoys that for like 2 -5 years, then just sells it for the same price, basically having payed absolutely nothing becouse they received all that monney back?

They didn't have to make the art, they didn't have to design and make the character, yet they have "used" it for all this time.

I'm not talking about rules here, I'm talking about friking standards. To me that's just ABSOLUTELY rude.

fibs

7 years, 6 months ago

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Absolutely.

Perhaps you're forgetting that someone actually has to consider it worth the new price and pay that much.

You can't just mind-control someone into "paying too much" (by your standards and not theirs.)

AeylinFaith

7 years, 6 months ago

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And you can't mind controll someone to follow the rules either, otherwise this would be a perfect world right.

I don't understand you, please stop from commenting on my journals and comments on that of others, i tried to understand your reasoning but right now you just screwed that up, if you are not even capable to see a different point of vieuw other than, your own and "the law/rules" go live in your own naïve world and don't try to tell others how wrong they are becouse they haven't read the rules.

Rules don't save you, "you are not allowed to steal/murder" yet these things are still happening...that's just one example lol.

fibs

7 years, 6 months ago

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Thanks for proving me right about this fandom.

AeylinFaith

7 years, 6 months ago

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Thanks for proving me right about your naïvity, you really believe its only in this fandom? LOL

Clara

7 years, 6 months ago

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Edited 7 years, 6 months ago by Owner

Honestly I get some reasons why you would resell adopts, but it really is unfair to sell them for higher DX
its funny that adopts dont loose value though, like with the closed species craze overtime their value increases!

AeylinFaith

7 years, 6 months ago

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Yeah me too, if your in money trouble and other things I get it, but at least mention to the artist your about to sell it and see if it's okay, or again, at least mention it.

I'm just not okay if it goes higher then bought. Tough in some cases it's just like "i'm bored of it" after like 5 years, and to me that's unfair. You can sell it and the art for like 3/4 of the price, but it just doesn't make sence to me, in the first place you bought this character and art, proberbly without the intention to sell it and for yourself, and then you just get rid of it when your done, without ANY loss, that's like.. bullshit

Quiet269

7 years, 6 months ago

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I really can't agree with this stance.

I hate adopts in general. The concept of them as a whole simply gets under my skin. But the act of selling the character.... no longer gives you any rights over it. It's theirs to do what they please with.

You can purchase a book when it's new; and sell it for a higher value if it is rare. You might also purchase a book to keep forever. Hell, you might purchase it, think you can resell it but never find a buyer.

I don't understand why you care what they do with a character that they now own... except that you want that extra money for yourself.

ShadowedEmber

7 years, 6 months ago

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but if you don't intend on keeping the character, why buy it? If you decide later you DONT want it, why not let someone that actually WANTS the character take it, for the original price? its more unfair to the customer that ends up with the character, who could have got it for less if they werent going though a middle man.

fibs

7 years, 6 months ago

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Why do retailers buy food? They're not gonna eat it.

Adoptables are a living and volatile market. Artists make adoptables and sell them to get money. Resellers buy them and sell them to make money.

Just like literally every single other market.

ShadowedEmber

7 years, 6 months ago

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Edited 7 years, 6 months ago by Owner

And a manufacturer has every right to blacklist a reseller that they feel isnt following their terms of service. It happens all the time, no?

fibs

7 years, 6 months ago

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That is a completely different point than that which you were arguing and one I did not at any point refute.

ShadowedEmber

7 years, 6 months ago

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"	Adding rules will make no difference; they will not have any binding because selling the character means you no longer have any control over it, i.e. cannot dictate its terms of use.

fibs

7 years, 6 months ago

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That is correct. A character you have already sold you cannot thereafter control. The artist's blacklist merely determines who she chooses to sell to in the future.

And when she sells the next character, that next person will also be free to resell it regardless of her objections, should they choose to do so.

Quiet269

7 years, 6 months ago

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My problem is with the note "I thought it would just be common sense not to try to sell them for higher then you bought, with nothing accounting for that extra cost.." That right there tells you that it's not about the ownership of the adoptable changing hands. This is a change specifically geared towards making money as the original artist, and fufu on anyone who might make money later on down the road.

If the adoptable is sold later at a lower cost, would the artist refund the difference?

This isn't Arizona Tea company saying "My product is worth exactly $0.99." It's an artist saying "My product is worth as much as I alone can make from it (BTW please keep bidding to raise the price); but don't you dare make any money off this later."

fibs

7 years, 6 months ago

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The artist's mistake is attempting to maintain both the artistic and commercial interests of adoptables simultaneously.

Selling adoptables is inherently a commercial market, but she wants the person she directly sells to to keep and use the character, an artistic interest.

There is absolutely no way for her to guarantee this while also "selling" proper the character. She would have to license them out instead, meaning they would remain hers legally. Indeed she is effectively trying to do that by installing Terms of Service, which apply only to licenses, not assignments of copyright.

Quiet269

7 years, 6 months ago

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I have to disagree... Her journal clearly states that her only issue with reselling adoptables if is you make more money than you spent on it.

fibs

7 years, 6 months ago

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She says it's unfair to her and to the end consumer, the implication being she doesn't want the character's end owner to be ripped off.

Quiet269

7 years, 6 months ago

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Edited 7 years, 6 months ago by Owner

Aye, she cares of they paid too much; but doesn't care if ownership changes hands

Clara

7 years, 6 months ago

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Edited 7 years, 6 months ago by Owner

To be honest with you hating of the idea of adoptables, I dont feel like its worth telling you why I care. So i'll just let you have your opinion on the matter...and leave it at that.

Quiet269

7 years, 6 months ago

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I understand why people buy them, and why people sell them. I just personally don't like them as a concept. If you enjoy the process more power to you. I just skip over them =P

fibs

7 years, 6 months ago

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Adding rules will make no difference; they will not have any binding because selling the character means you no longer have any control over it, i.e. cannot dictate its terms of use. You sold the character for $10.00, received $10.00, and whatever happens afterward is of absolutely no wrong to you.

Reselling product is a typical business tactic that's been exercised in every market all throughout human history. High-profile resellers such as retail stores naturally provide substantial additional services that justify the markup, but buying low and selling dear with no additional value is a key strategy of the stock market, gold trade, and really any businessman worth his salt, such as a pawn shop.

What you should consider instead is raising the price of the character because it is obviously worth more than that. A ready-made, professional design is worth a good sight more than $10.00 -- that's why reselling works. Someone is willing to pay that much, and you'll want them to pay it to you, not some middle-man.

Clara

7 years, 6 months ago

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I do think adding the rules will make some people think twice about doing this.
I dont know much about the legal part of this, so I wont sit here and say something as if I do.

And the reason for some my adopts being as low as they are is so that people that would enjoy them can still afford them, so I think i'll keep some of them as is.

fibs

7 years, 6 months ago

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If your primary reasoning is that you want everyone to enjoy them, shouldn't you be raffling them off for free?

Clara

7 years, 6 months ago

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lol ok guess I shouldnt have the THE reason, its one of the reasons their priced the way they are.

Claws61821

7 years, 6 months ago

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Except that this argument ignores basic contract law with regards to the sales market. If you purchase something under a contract and you then break that contract, the sale becomes void and any repercussions listed within the legal binding come into effect.

fibs

7 years, 6 months ago

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Edited 7 years, 6 months ago by Owner

@ Claws61821

That law applies to "goods", which must be attached to reality (physical objects.) In addition, it only applies to goods that were in physical existence at the time of sale.

Ergo it does not apply to the transfers of copyrights applicable to adoptables as they are not attached to reality. It would apply only to individual physical items such as print copies, plushies, etc. that already existed at the time they were bought, as opposed to specially-ordered to be created at a future date.

AlexanderValentine

7 years, 6 months ago

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they're called adoptables. not fosterables.

fibs

7 years, 6 months ago

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@ AlexanderValentine

What do you mean? I'm honestly not sure which side you're on with this comment.

eeveefan

7 years, 6 months ago

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ive seen this happen before. the best you can do is ban them from buying from you again and trust the people who buy from you regularly or those that like you to tell you weather or not the person who bought it from you is reselling it for a higher price. id never sell anything I get from you, why would I? their to adorable!! >w<

don't worry Laine if I ever see anyone selling your adopts they got from you for high prices ill let you know ;P

Clara

7 years, 6 months ago

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@ eeveefan

I have to, but for higher priced adopts then my own ovo!
Yeah thats what I plan to do, nothing I can do after the fact except ban/block them D:

eeveefan

7 years, 6 months ago

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yeah. its sad when people would go to these lengths just to try to make money off it. I think its a scam tbh.
if you cant buy the adopt to keep it then don't buy it. nothing you can really do except ignore/ ban them and move on.
I have seen someone who got a adopt off you then turn around and tried auctioning off the virginity of the char then went saying they were quitting and sold the char to someone.
people need to stop being dumb and learn to take care of the chars they get and not pawn them off like their some kinda cash card.

fibs

7 years, 6 months ago

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@ eeveefan

The reseller states the exact price and exactly what is being sold and sells it for that price. That is not a "scam". You don't get to call it a scam just because someone else paid more than you would have for something.

What exactly does the "virginity" of the character have to do with anything? They're not real. They don't have a state of virginity. The next person to buy the character is free to reboot and deny any of that ever happened.

The adoptable fandom has an odd way of taking itself both too seriously and not seriously enough at the same time.

eeveefan

7 years, 6 months ago

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ive seen you talk about buying and selling crap here and you replied to every comment that's had bad feedback to this. get lost.
honestly I don't care what YOU think about this and what lodgic you have in trying to tell me otherwise.

and it is a scam. you get an adopt for 10 dollars off the seller then turn around and sell it for 50 to someone else is a scam, meaning their only getting the adopts to resell for a larger sum and try to make more money off it thus stealing monetary value from the original artist and maker who ALLOWED them to buy it off them. now if youll excuse me its time to block a troll owo

Clara

7 years, 6 months ago

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@ eeveefan

Oddly enough I dont really have a problem with virginity auctions ovo;;;
Or reselling them, I know I have a few adopts I bought for $100+ that I would sell in a heartbeat if I needed to, but not for more then what I paid for them lol

Nightdancer

7 years, 6 months ago

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Wtf who would do this?!? 😠

fibs

7 years, 6 months ago

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@ Nightdancer

A shrewd businessman.

caramelthecalf

7 years, 6 months ago

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