Breaking Bad (beware, spoilers) by Wolfblade < Journal

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FPFP

11 years, 7 months ago

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That bitch deserves nothing less. Good god. I can't stop fucking thinking about it. >:C

Wolfblade

11 years, 7 months ago

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@ FPFP

And Jessie's fucking girlfriend! Hey look, an actual cool female character who seems sweet and nice and oh no, I feel bad for her cuz Jessie's a dumbass BUT THEN OH WAIT.

FPFP

11 years, 7 months ago

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@ Wolfblade

OH WAIT, she's just a fucking CUNT too. Druggie bitch.

YamatoIouko

11 years, 7 months ago

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It's being written by a section of the furry fandom?

Sorry, I had to. XD

KhellSennet

11 years, 7 months ago

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It's a toss-up by the end who is worse, Marie or Skyler. Yes, the show would have been better with them getting some .45 asprin by the end.

Wolfblade

11 years, 7 months ago

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@ KhellSennet

I >immediately< hated the sister. But then the intervention episode, I'm like, okay awesome. She's passable now. Then they had the klepto arc that served ZERO purpose to further ANY story or character development except to counter her likeability points and to give Skyler more reason to go BUT WHAT ABOUT >>>MY<<< PAIN

KhellSennet

11 years, 7 months ago

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@ Wolfblade

Trust me, you will hate her again. And again. And then you'll feel sorry for her for a brief bit in Season 4, but the hate returns by the end.

Shokuji

11 years, 7 months ago

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Breaking Bad is a great show. I sorta started in the middle though, need to start from the beginning sometime, but I'm already interested in wtf is going on. XD So, even though I don't fully understand what I watched, I can say it was very interesting. =3

Wolfblade

11 years, 7 months ago

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@ Shokuji

watch it from the beginning dude, it's on netflix. :P

Shokuji

11 years, 7 months ago

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@ Wolfblade

I'm too poor for netflix. =/ Although that may be changing soon, hopefully.

TuneCharmer

11 years, 7 months ago

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Stick it to them feminists lol

Wolfblade

11 years, 7 months ago

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Edited 11 years, 7 months ago by Owner

@ TuneCharmer

No, see, dude, I don't like feminists, but I don't like misogynists either. I get called sexist sometimes because I believe in >actual< equality except where things simply are not equal (like I absolutely support equal pay for women doing the same job as men, but I do NOT support women being given lowered standards to obtain the same jobs as men where physical performance minimums are required - police, firefighters, military, etc) but I'm not sexist. I just hate any person of any group that is validating their groups negative stereotypes.

So I'm not like "Yeah, you go Breaking Bad writers, show the world what women are really like" or anything, I'm just reeeeeeeally frustrated by this awesome show having such >extreme< concentrations of the negative stereotypical female behaviors in their female characters.

Stereotypes aren't pulled out of thin air, they exist for a reason, but there is something wrong when you can't have a female character that isn't anything BUT all the stereotypes. XC

TuneCharmer

11 years, 7 months ago

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@ Wolfblade

I so want to talk about this more but if I say more this whole page is gonna be filled XD

Nyarlathotep

11 years, 7 months ago

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Edited 11 years, 7 months ago by Owner

@ Wolfblade

"	Wolfblade wrote:
	physical performance minimums ... police

Hahaha, the only cop in my town who isn't a wheezing sack of lard is a woman. Police don't work that way, dude.

Wolfblade

11 years, 7 months ago

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@ Nyarlathotep

There's always exceptions. An exception isn't a valid counterpoint to an argument made about a general issue. The fact that your average woman could probably kick >my< soft marshmallowy ass with relative ease doesn't negate the fact that in general, your average woman is physically weaker than the average man.

There will always be instances where people get a job they weren't qualified for. But at some point in the initial training process, there are >supposed< to be physical standards to meet. The point I was making was that whatever standards need to be met to acquire a job, they need to be the same regardless of gender.

Aside from the greater potential for lapses in maintaining standards that police might have, we'll use the military for a (usually) more strict example. You join the military, you go through basic training, you have to meet certain physical performance standards. For a female to earn the same job, rank, and pay grade, the required physical standards are >significantly< lowered. This is not an act of equality and fairness, it is ignoring that the position has physical standards because a person who cannot perform those physical standards is unfit to do the required duties and tasks that are demanded of the position, and just giving a lowered standard to give the >illusion< of equality. There is nothing wrong with a female in the military who can meet the same physical demands as the men in the military. There IS something wrong with placing a person in a military operation with a partner who is incapable of carrying his incapacitated ass to safety in the way a person - male or female - WOULD have been able to do had they been held to the same physical standards across the board. That was part of Basic Training, we had to learn the Fireman Carry in case we ever had to haul a wounded partner to safety. They had the girls practice on the other girls, half of them couldn't even carry another girl, but so long as they all tried it, they passed. The guys could not proceed until they'd managed to carry another full grown male from point A to point B. This is a potential matter of Life and Death, but for the >Illusion< of equality, it's ignored.

The point is; a woman doing the exact same job as a man and not getting equal pay is inequality, unjust, and unfair. Absolutely Not Right, and should be addressed and corrected. But so is a woman being given lowered standards to acquire the same job and same pay as a man. Rather, ANY person, for ANY reason, being given a job that they are less qualified for than another applicant is an injustice, even when it is done in the name of "equality" and trying to counter-balance some other perceived inequality. I am all for equality, but that doesn't mean "give everyone the same rewards regardless of their differing qualifications," nor does it mean "force artificial preference to people of this or that group because we have to assume that every employer and every institution is incapable of NOT showing preference against them," it means give equal reward to people of equal qualification and gender/race/etc are removed as factors in the equation.

TrentSnow

11 years, 7 months ago

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I'm finishing season 4 tonight...and I'm doing it in STYLE!

SilverTail

11 years, 7 months ago

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@ TrentSnow

Enjoy your alcohol poisoning XD

TrentSnow

11 years, 7 months ago

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@ SilverTail

Lol! I know...to even attempt this is lunacy! XP

Tweaker

11 years, 7 months ago

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You'll love the later seasons. Trust me on this one.

RagnarArcano

11 years, 7 months ago

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That show is so awesome I just finished watching season 5

melfluff

11 years, 7 months ago

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Oh God. Hurry up and get to season 5 O.O

Orcinus

11 years, 7 months ago

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Oh man, if you think Skyler's bad now, wait until season 5. You'll wanna put a slug in that bitch's head yourself.

SashaBelle

11 years, 7 months ago

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I don't understand why everyone hates her. Think from her perspective! Walt is being deliberately distant as a husband and obviously lying about several things even when confronted straight up about them. He's a total dick to his wife. The truth behind it all isn't any better anyway and doesn't make it okay. It would probably be more understandable if he was just a normal asshole having an affair. And besides, why would he kill her when she's half the reason he's doing it anyway?

mousehwolf

11 years, 7 months ago

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Edited 11 years, 7 months ago by Owner

@ SashaBelle

Yes, yes, yes. Thank you.

Wolfblade

11 years, 7 months ago

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@ SashaBelle

Here we go. XD

'Think from her perspective' is WHY I hate the character so much. 'From her perspective' means not knowing ANYTHING that we know as the audience. She is WAY overly suspicious and bitchy right from the start, way before >she< is given even the slightest hints that he's lying. All the stuff she reacts to initially is so much more easily explained by 'sorry for being distant and distraught, I'M JUST DYING OF CANCER IS ALL, please forgive me inconveniencing you this way.'

So she starts to think he's lying. Even then, fuck her. And here's why;

She had that intervention. She was ALL about honesty and truth and everybody just speak how you really feel. Her sister does so, and gets super bitched at. She doesn't ACTUALLY want honesty from anyone, she just wants everybody to try and force her husband into taking chemo therapy for what - as far as they knew at that time - was inoperable cancer with the chemo having almost zero chance of doing anything except prolonging his life by weeks or maybe months. He bares his soul to them, explaining how whatever time he has left, he wants to live it as a complete person, and if he's going to die, he doesn't want to be a sick shell of a person for the last of his time just to stretch that misery out a few more weeks. ALSO that he doesn't want to leave his family with the final memory of him being a wraith, AND the debt that the futile treatments would leave them. He says he's felt his whole life was beyond his control and now this choice was all he had left. After That Speech, and her STILL giving absolute zero concern for HIS wishes - his DYING wishes - she was cold to HIM and so he caved and agreed to do the damn chemo.

Even knowing his feelings on it, she still made him do it. Because fuck him, fuck his wishes, fuck her sister's thoughts, fuck everybody but Skyler. All that character has ever been concerned about is herself.

SO, she asks for truth, she GETS truth, she disregards truth. Because it's not what she WANTS to hear. When you do that, you have no claim to bitch about being lied to. She created the situation where he either does what she wants, disregards his wants, lets them flush their financial future down the drain to make him suffer MUCH worse, and a little bit longer than he already has to - OR - he does what he feels he needs to do and just lies his ass off to try and keep her off his back until he's dead and she can hopefully be grateful after he's gone.

Remember, as far as he knew, he'd be dead in a matter of months. He's not concerned about being the good husband when she forces that to mean 'disregard everything except my overemotional and irrational demands regardless of the long-term consequences I'm incapable of seeing.' He's just concerned with leaving them what they need to take care of themselves, whatever it takes to do so.

She doesn't care about her husband dying beyond how much it's hurting >her.< She doesn't care about her sister's klepto problem beyond how it embarrassed >her< and how she >has< to have >her< apology. She smokes while pregnant because >her< pain and stress is more important than the baby's health (which, btw, was her hiding something from Walt - something that harms their child, while his hidden activities were only risking himself). Even though she'd accused him of hiding an affair, she doesn't care about being faithful to him when she gets back in the office with that other guy she clearly knows was - and still is - interested in her and she >encourages< his attentions.

At the start, when they thought the treatment had low chance of success, she doesn't give half a shit about money because she assumes they'll be able to leech it from his rich friends or somewhere. Later, when they find out an operation might remove the tumors completely - when the risk of the money is for a real chance at >not dying at all< she's all hesitant.

Then the moment he's through his battle with cancer, she tells him to get out of the house.

Wolfblade

11 years, 7 months ago

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@ SashaBelle

Short version: She confronts him straight up, and at the start, he was straight up and honest to her. And it didn't matter for shit.

So he does what he has to do, what he sees as the only option to keep his wife from ruining her and their son's future, while also paying for her demand that he make himself sicker in his last few months.

She's a horrible, selfish character who, by the end of season 2, has not done >one thing< to sacrifice any of her own wants or feelings for >anyone< else, not even so little as NOT SMOKING WHILE PREGNANT - while the guy who's >DYING< has done all that he's done >for her.<

My extreme dislike for this character is because any forced sympathy for her can >ONLY< come from a result of the bullshit "well, she's a woman so she's weaker than a man and you have to accept that she can't handle things as well." I hate the attitude that it's acceptable for women to completely fall apart and lose all rationality and still get sympathy and a pass for it because hey, the poor feeble-minded woman. If the wife is dying and the husband falls apart like Skyler did and throws all rationality out the window, nobody would have sympathy for the male character being so selfish and short-sighted. She's an extreme 'weak-minded, irrational, over-emotional female' stereotype, and I really hate those kinds of reinforcements of 'feel sorry for the poor crazy woman.'

He tried honesty and reason, it bounced off, she doesn't get the sympathy card for being lied to afterward.

ragz

11 years, 7 months ago

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To be fair, everyone in Breaking Bad is pretty much a horrible, horrible person, with the exception of Hank, who just has the absolute shittiest luck ever and a wife who is fucking nuts.

Wolfblade

11 years, 7 months ago

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@ ragz

The son isn't horrible yet, and while it's clear Walt is only going to go farther down the darkside road, he's not a horrible person at this point either.

Hell, they've given more reason to like >Jessie,< the druggie loser idiot than they have given any reason to give two craps about Skyler.

chippysbud2

11 years, 7 months ago

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no matter how much i agree with you on my hatred of skylar. i just have to say, atleast she's not peggy hill.

FennyTFox

11 years, 7 months ago

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Keep watching the rest and you will hate (think they are friggin horrible) all BUT the characters that should traditionally be hated (the ones that really ought to be thought of as horrible from the start). The show is really well written like that - they really have away of slowly making each character more and more complex as it goes.

Friggin love Breaking Bad and am really wishing they would would get on with it and not split the last season up like they are!

Cubbystripes

11 years, 7 months ago

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Haha. Your thoughts and mine are exactly in line about Skyler.

ottah

11 years, 7 months ago

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Walter isn't such a good character and he doesn't get better. I don't think any of the characters where that good of people to begin with. I do say I like what they do with Jessie later.

Wolfblade

11 years, 7 months ago

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@ ottah

Walter is a good character at the start. Good father, good husband, passionate teacher. When he learns he Is Going To Die, that is when he decides the law doesn't matter, he just has to see that his family will be taken care of, and it's reasonable that he doesn't have time to be concerned with anything else like social niceties or pandering to his overdemanding wife. None of that matters because once he's dead, that's it, he can't do anything for anyone, so he just doesn't have the time to waste.

He very very quickly goes too far down that road, yes, but the only example of him being less-than-nice-guy from the start is his treatment of Jessie. I agree that I wish he'd just be fucking nice to the guy, even a little bit, but from Walt's perspective, this is a former student who never applied himself in class, and has clearly chosen to just throw his life away after school. Walt's character has no reason to see Jessie as anything other than the means to his ends because Jessie has made >himself< nothing of note or worth or given any reason for anyone to presume that he's even worth wasting any energy on to try and get him to pick himself up.

EVEN SO, by the end of the second season, they'd been through enough together where Walt - being a good guy - has acquired enough knowledge of Jessie beyond just the surface Jessie has chosen to have so he does start to care about the guy and want to help him. He wasn't trying to screw Jessie out of his share (even though given the circumstances I personally feel he WOULD have been totally justified in telling Jessie to fuck off), he was only keeping it until he had reasonable certainty that Jessie wouldn't just shoot half a million up his arms and DIE.

I dunno where their relationship goes after the second season (no spoilers please), and I'm sure it will probably be downhill, but up to what I've seen, all Walt's faults and misdeeds are reasonable and understandable given the circumstances of the character, and do not negate his status as a Good Guy, it just makes him a realistic character who is more concerned about achieving the results he needs to achieve (all at self-sacrifice for the benefit of his family and NOT himself) with little to no other options to achieve them. Everything he does to mistreat his family or Jessie are only because they are obstructing his efforts and he simply doesn't have time to make people feel good.

The first thing he did that was arguably unjustifiable was not helping Jessie's gf. And even then, it was a sudden thing, not premeditated, he had only a minute to make a decision, and it's understandable that he hesitated. To his perspective, this girl was pulling Jessie father down than he'd even let himself go already, it was her fault they nearly missed the big deal, and then she blackmailed him and even when he brought the money, she outright said that he >couldn't< know that she wouldn't expose him anyway. All he'd done, all for his family, and at that point he was beginning to be concerned about Jessie too, and this girl would undo ALL of it. He didn't choose to make something happen there, he just panicked and hesitated and didn't stop what happened as a result of her own actions and could have happened whether he'd been there or not.

(I love discussing this sort of thing by the way. XD )

Charn

11 years, 7 months ago

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I noticed that in Nip Tuck too, and in House, they keep making the females be basically these overly-emotional, manipulative, EXTREMELY hippocritical loud mouths who ALWAYS make the *wrong* mistake and then blame everyone else. It's so infuriating because it's SO PREDICTABLE.

Wolfblade

11 years, 7 months ago

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@ Charn

I haven't seen those, and don't watch much tv at all anyways, but I didn't think the negative female stereotypes would slide anymore. Most of the time, you only ever see the smart, witty, beautiful wife/girlfriend with the Complete Dumbfuck husband/boyfriend/etc.

I just hate stereotypes. Doesn't matter who or what group, I just hate stereotypes and the people who validate them. I like characters that are >people< without fitting into cookie-cutter little character slots. It's why I liked Buffy so much. It had it's cliches but the characters always deviated in one way or another, and all of them ultimately grew beyond whatever archetype they may have started out as. Well maybe not Angel so much, he never seemed to change. XP

As much as I'm enjoying this show for the most part, I just don't know if I'll be able to finish it with people saying that this problem of super narrow writing for the females only gets worse. :/

redlizard

11 years, 7 months ago

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Skyler and Marie wasn't written well in first couple of seasons, I agreed.

Fortunately, the writing for female characters have gotten better in Season 3, 4, and 5. You will see why.

gorrila11

11 years, 7 months ago

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Skyler gets better later, the writers finally figure out how to write women. Lots of people still hate her for...disliking Walt more and more as time goes on, but I'd be more worried if she *did* still like her husband even though he's emotionally distant, borderline abusive, and a meth cook and murderer.

Wolfblade

11 years, 7 months ago

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Edited 11 years, 7 months ago by Owner

@ gorrila11

Once she's >aware< of his bad deeds, then yes, her attitude towards him would make more sense.

However, at the last episode I saw (end of season 2), she's ordered him to leave his own house just after his cancer surgery when she knows >nothing< of what he's done other than that he's lied. So if she does end up learning the full truth, and yet still stays with him anyway, I'm just going to hate her all the more.

"My husband lied to me about something - I don't know what other than it's about him coming up with the money for the cancer treatment >I< forced him to do even knowing we couldn't afford it - while he was >dying of cancer< (and after I showed a complete and total disregard for anyone else's truth and feelings when I did get them), he's only just now finally beat the cancer and isn't in the process of dying, I'm not even going to let him tell me what it was, I just want him gone." but then "Now I know my husband is a meth cook and murderer, well, I guess I'll stay with him anyway."

They'd already made the character too much of a hard-ass at Walt for the most petty and stupidly trivial bullshit (again, she didn't have any solid awareness of any of the big lies until the last moment). If she stays >AFTER< knowing he's a meth cook and murderer and is continuing this after it's no longer a matter of 'the dying man just trying to make sure his family's cared for,' then there's no believable explanation for her change of principles other than the money. :/

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