As some of you may know, last week a few Japanese artists have moved off Patreon recently as a result of them cracking down on NSFW images and how they're drawn. Really insane drama about the "face looking too young" or something. I feel like it's only a matter of time until they start cracking down further, maybe even getting rid of NSFW entirely ala Tumblr and depriving a lot of people of a livelihood. Because of that, I've been very busy this week coming up with a solution.
The program is called DR-Mask and it can be used to make it so you never have to upload an NSFW image online to get it to your viewers. All you need is an SFW source image (usually a variant of the NSFW art with clothes or whatever), the image you actually want people to see, and dr-mask creates a 3rd image you can upload anywhere which contains all the data your viewers need to turn the SFW image back into the NSFW image.
In addition, you can even password-protect the masking output (a "difference map" or diff for short), making it practically indecipherable without the correct code. This extra bit of security can let you put the secret code in a Patreon journal, or on Twitter, or wherever you like.
When your viewers/customers want to see an uncensored image, all they have to do is put into the program the SFW image, the diff, and your key (a string of letters and numbers generated by the program). Boom, the NSFW/Uncensored image is recreated on their computer.
Please tell anyone who you think might be able to get use out of this program, as wider adoption will help bring more interest in this form of anti-censorship method. I hope to make it so that it can be run inside your web-browser, but I'm hoping others will come with even better ways to streamline the process (like a browser plugin, maybe?)
More details and a readme is available on the GitHub page!! If you have any questions, please feel free to ask me here and I will try to answer them as best I can. https://github.com/nobuyukinyuu/dr-mask
This is a lot of work to go through that will dramatically reduce patron engagement; Patreon will most likely simply update its ToS to allow it to police you for proof of DR'd images and ban for this too.
This is a lot of work to go through that will dramatically reduce patron engagement; Patreon will mo
Well, I think it might reduce a limited amount of engagement, but it's better than no engagement at all, wouldn't you say? That's what happens when you're under the threat of de-platforming...
Anyway, an update to ToS like that would be quite draconian, but not totally unexpected given that trolling people's social media links is apparently what started this (from what I hear). Plausible deniability is the key here, and that's why the images are not only split, but why the source images are 100% legit to be posted anywhere, with no way to recreate the target image without the difference (and optional configuration) data. All image obfuscation passes are optional. You add as much or as little as you think you need to create the plausible deniability you need. You can even host the diff images on an imageboard or something.
Well, I think it might reduce a limited amount of engagement, but it's better than no engagement at
I didn't realize I was obligated to continue responding.
I didn't do so with this chain because other replies have already thoroughly covered this aspect, i.e. that Patreon already bans for off-site delivery and will likely count this as such once they're aware of it. It wouldn't be possible to hide, because you have to tell your Patrons how to use it, which means Patreon will know about it.
I didn't realize I was obligated to continue responding. I didn't do so with this chain because ot
Sounds like a chicken-and-egg problem to me. It's not practical because it's not already ubiquitous, and it's not ubiquitous because it isn't practical. I will do what I can to increase awareness so that such explicit "self-outing" won't be necessary. But, of course, there will always be people who will still consider this not practical enough to suit their needs. That's fine. I'd recommend looking into the censorship-circumvention tag on GitHub if you want to see other systems that you may also consider impractical. Maybe you can see how these compare and be able to come up with a more practical solution for artists specifically based on what you can glean from that. PRs and practical suggestions welcome.
Sounds like a chicken-and-egg problem to me. It's not practical because it's not already ubiquitous
I get that you're really proud of this trick and all, but you're just being stubborn. There is no "chicken and egg" problem. There is a "this won't work literally at all" problem. It won't work when it isn't well-known because nobody will know to do it. It won't work once it is well-known because, by that virtue, Patreon will also know you're doing it and they won't put up with that.
While it's a fascinating technology with various practical and novel applications, this is not one of them.
I get that you're really proud of this trick and all, but you're just being stubborn. There is no "c
Well, I'm afraid I disagree. I've already shown how plausible deniability can be established, and am ready and willing to work to help people get past any future challenges that may arise. I don't seem to see with the same certainty you have for dismissing this workaround as a futile endeavor, nor (based on the other locked thread) do I see you promoting any positive alternatives, platforms, solutions or otherwise, quite to the contrary. It seems like your only purpose in the comments section has been to spread fear, uncertainty, and doubt about those things. Why, though? What reason would there be to detract so much from the general tone of the conversation?
Others have suggested helpful alternatives and suggestions for improvement. lf you feel like you have anything else to add, please feel free to drop me a note. I don't want to further detract from the purpose of leaving the comments open, which is to help creators work around issues that make it harder for them to earn a living off their works with the original intent intact.
Well, I'm afraid I disagree. I've already shown how plausible deniability can be established, and a
They already do this. They shut down people who use off-site methods of distributing work, whether personally mailing stuff to their supporters or even using discord servers to share the work. They will require you give them access to verify that your content falls in line with their website.
They already do this. They shut down people who use off-site methods of distributing work, whether p
Patreon will just end up failing as a business platform then. It's already shown to be unprofitable as a website, eventually investment money will run dry, and they're only alienating people that actually want to use it.
#getwokegobroke as they say.
Patreon will just end up failing as a business platform then. It's already shown to be unprofitable
Sadly, patreon's been shut that down. They will require you to give them access to your discord servers to make sure that content falls in line with their website rules regardless.
Sadly, patreon's been shut that down. They will require you to give them access to your discord serv
that's pretty insane, haha. Why would anyone want to let the moral police in their private servers? Heck. It's almost like an arms race to maintain one's own livelihood on the major platforms. Perhaps it's only a matter of time before they start inspecting our code for wrongthink, too, but I doubt the people on the bottom being paid to police the art creators specifically are authorized to run or compile foreign code on the clock in the pursuit of whatever the goals of their corporate overlords are..... yet....
that's pretty insane, haha. Why would anyone want to let the moral police in their private servers?
Why? Because if you don't, they ban you. The moderation of Patreon is incredibly biased, too. I've seen some who got banned for simply posting art of gay people kissing before because one admin had a vendetta against certain people.
Why? Because if you don't, they ban you. The moderation of Patreon is incredibly biased, too. I've s
somewhat difficult to misuse as it really only works very well on digital art. Images need to be perfectly aligned and preferably "simple" to compress well and not show an after-image of the component parts. At least that was my hope when designing it!
somewhat difficult to misuse as it really only works very well on digital art. Images need to be per
This is steganography, otherwise known as the art of hiding things in plain sight. The modern usage of this technique usually involves altering a series of pixels within an art piece (by subtle changes in pixel color, usually), then using a key/passphrase on a piece of software to convert the image into another image, or sometimes another file format entirely.
I believe steganography is still regarded in a grey area of legality. It has legitimate uses, such as printers using a small bit of yellow ink to make legal timestamps and serial numbers that only experts can see. It also has illegitimate uses.
I am fairly certain that using this system would be an attempt to skirt around Patreon's Terms of Services, but I am not fully certain. If this is the technique you want to use, then that is your choice. I just hope I can assist in helping you make an informed decision.
This is steganography, otherwise known as the art of hiding things in plain sight. The modern usage
In-image steganography is a no-go. That's hosting all the content needed to recreate the target image on the host platform and would definitely be against ToS. This is a different method from hiding one image inside another; it is a synthesis of two images and a passcode. The idea here is that the data contained in the difference map is a separate file and nothing inside the source image contains any data which can lead to the target image. All data except for the source image should be hosted elsewhere for maximum compliance with the terms of the site the source image would be hosted on.
In-image steganography is a no-go. That's hosting all the content needed to recreate the target ima
Thank you for bringing this issue up! I'm sure some people would have some initial concerns that this method won't work based on the presumption it is still breaking the ToS of other websites. It would be very difficult to construct such a ToS that would do so short of policing what you draw on every other online platform!
That won't stop them from trying, though. You can already get in trouble on Patreon (and sometimes FA) for linking to other websites which may contain material they find objectionable, especially if that material obviously belongs to you. It's definitely a broad stroke and depends on how far the moderators are willing to chase you off-site. The fact they're concerned with off-site material at all though is a real head-scratcher...
Thank you for bringing this issue up! I'm sure some people would have some initial concerns that th
There's several reasons for this. Sometimes, an appropriate platform isn't available or practical, such as when you wish to deliver the full set of content only to specific people. The primary content provider may have a privileged market position that the others don't. Both platforms may be hostile in some way, etc.
There's several reasons for this. Sometimes, an appropriate platform isn't available or practical,
I'd suggest changing the way the mask is output (and, by necessity, input). Although passcodes can be used, it's very easy to tell at a glance what's going to change. Maybe that's a feature to some; I dunno.
I'd suggest changing the way the mask is output (and, by necessity, input). Although passcodes can
I'm considering improving the obfuscation process with color modulation, additional salting, and (perhaps most importantly) region cropping support. Unfortunately i ran into some trouble with color modulation creating weird artifacts in-GPU and had to remove that feature.
When i designed the first iteration of the scheme (many years ago!), imageboards were much more popular than they currently are and this was mainly designed for Japanese users as an alternative to reversible masks to de-mosaic images on places like dlsite and the like. These days there are different issues with certain western platforms which seem to be going after artists for reasons completely different to business practicality or legal liability (this generation's corporate morality, perhaps?), so yes, obfuscating the output more would be helpful and it's something I'd like to work on further. As a user, though, obfuscating the input is up to you. The source image is only as innocuous as you make it.
I'm considering improving the obfuscation process with color modulation, additional salting, and (pe
If only people hadn't gone after inkbunny's merchant provider, perhaps we'd still have a point-of-sale system and could all make a livelihood without having to work with so many hostile platforms...
If only people hadn't gone after inkbunny's merchant provider, perhaps we'd still have a point-of-sa
*ponders* An automatic decensor browser addon should be possible. like, it could have access to an artist provided database of hashes of images, and add a little de-censor button next to any such image to automate the process.
Then the argument of it being a pain in the ass as many people point out no longer really applies.
*ponders* An automatic decensor browser addon should be possible. like, it could have access to an a
I agree! Although this would add a central point of failure; I'd prefer someone else to handle the logistics and legal liability of that. Imagine how much trouble sites like archive.org, archive.is, even 4chan and 8kun have to deal with just to host content. I've had a taste of that before a long time ago, and it's well beyond my personal scope these days in an increasingly hostile, increasingly corporate environment. I just wanna make fluff and video games in peace, sheesh ;w;
Not to mention I'm not much of a web developer (like, at all), but it's definitely something I'd like to see, and I hope that by open-sourcing my work, it encourages people to come up with more convenient solutions like the one you're describing.
I agree! Although this would add a central point of failure; I'd prefer someone else to handle the
I think it brings an alternative to the issue at hand, but since the ToS can be changed, i'm thinking they would still go after these creators anyway. I think the problem is the politics around this kind of art. There just needs to be an appropriate platform which focuses in adult content which keeps all aspects of it legal and feasible for the creators and runners to monetize it.
I used to work for a hentai chain, and a very important part of it was the legality aspects in terms of how to limit the material to the public, keep all disclaimers in rule, and make sure only our subscribers had access to the material. The gatekeeping was easier because we relied on Credit card access, but it was a surefire method of avoiding minors browsing the material.
This model didn't have as broad access to creators, and the earnings were split; but i'm thinking if it were to switch to a patreon-like structure, Just having a legal team behind it could make all the difference in creating a space where this material can be freely and safely distributed.
This is rather impressive! I think it brings an alternative to the issue at hand, but since the To
Oh yeah, I'm under no illusion that people with an ideological goal will twist themselves into a knot trying to find the proper legalese to make this a bootable offense, but first, they will have to identify the scope of it, and that's a lot harder to do if they're not policing every single platform you post to. Like I said earlier up in the comments, that doesn't mean they won't try, though. I had no idea, for example, that you apparently have to let patreon mods take a look at your discord server now? If that's true, that's crazy.
Oh, and since you've worked in a professional capacity on this, you probably know how difficult it is to get a merchant provider to work with your platform on stuff like this. Patreon is in a privileged position thanks to their special deal that allows them to take PayPal payments for work that is technically against PayPal's own ToS (or at least it was in the past and has been in a legal gray area for years). That's why alternatives like SubscribeStar can't use PayPal. Patreon's Trust and Safety manager spent 8 years at PayPal as risk ops manager, and several more on the advisory board of various banks and merchant providers! Really makes you think.
I'm fairly convinced we're dealing with some kind of corporate morality here, and it's a much more difficult problem to overcome than just throwing more money at one of the providers to convince them to take on the additional "risk". They're as fickle as the wind, and that's why with recent events I thought it was time to turn an earlier proof of concept into a real solution that could provide some additional insurance on the creators' behalf.
Oh yeah, I'm under no illusion that people with an ideological goal will twist themselves into a kno
Is SubscribeStar not a better option than Patreon? Ever since they started silencing dissenting political voices, they're coming after anyone that does Adult content. First it'll be art styles they find 'offensive' like the anime/manga style because they (the Patreon Morality Police) decide it 'looks too young' to be showing off suggestive poses. This would be true if they were loli's/Shota but they aren't. They're full bodied adults with the proper proportions (albeit exaggerated for obvious reasons). It sucks that SubscribeStar can't use PayPal but there are other sites that can or just directly funding a PayPal account from a bank/credit union account linked with it.
Everyone and their mother's dog are looking to try and police things so they're 'family friendly', more sanitization of the internet in hopes of making it a better source of revenue.
Is SubscribeStar not a better option than Patreon? Ever since they started silencing dissenting poli
I've seen a few artists using it, but it definitely gets the same kinda bad rap that makes ppl shy of them the same way ppl are shy of inkbunny. Undeserved, I think! I hate the chilling effect this creates, tbh. Sometimes right after a moral panic a bunch of people leave here and it feels like we're in a ghetto, and what for? Not for a lack of professionalism or technical proficiency, that's for sure...
I've seen a few artists using it, but it definitely gets the same kinda bad rap that makes ppl shy o
People snub SubscribeStar because it was explicitly founded to harbor the neo-nazis and generally reprehensible people chased off of Patreon, Youtube, Paypal, etc., who made up its first 100 or so users. It will never escape this image.
Patreon's "ban on anime" is largely bullshit spewed out by a single artist who draws blatant and repeated loli art, who got butthurt when he got caught and wanted to make his problem everybody else's problem.
People snub SubscribeStar because it was explicitly founded to harbor the neo-nazis and generally re
I think this was a rather contentious (and frankly incendiary) thing to say, and considering you didn't respond to my reply to you in the other thread I can only assume that you might not be participating entirely in good faith here. If you have solutions, feel free to talk about them, and the same goes if you have any questions about mine. But please stick to that. I don't want to see people making snipes in my comments section, becoming uncivil with each other, and forcing me to clean up the mess. No more flamebait, please.
I think this was a rather contentious (and frankly incendiary) thing to say, and considering you did
Assuming every one of your (former?) patrons were to know that you are now using this system, I would imagine a noticeable drop-off in patrons due to the amount of work it takes just to be able to view an image, which the average person isn't going to understand nor care about.
It's less effort to just use a different website that functions essentially the same way, or any other more loosely related alternative that as far as the user is concerned behaves more-or-less the same.
Patreon may want to ban certain content but they don't have that many people to check it. Especially if you're sneakier by using PMs or Discord, the odds of them catching on and banning are fairly low, and I'd wager a bet that you could get by with making another account after that and keep going, assuming they don't ban any account using your paypal/bank information.
Assuming every one of your (former?) patrons were to know that you are now using this system, I woul
Any suggestions on how to improve the access method to maintain higher engagement rates with patrons, presuming the system is that inconvenient? I imagine under extreme circumstances, most people would understand the need for such measures and is definitely easier to maintain engagement on an existing platform than to hope most of your patrons migrate with you to one of the alternatives, given that none of them can support PayPal for reasons I've gone over earlier in the comments. However, that's definitely one option for artists to consider and I've suggested it before in the past, for sure.
I've planned features to increase the convenience and value of the delivery system by allowing it to produce variations for the people who tend to sell multiple variations as gated exclusives, but I'm open to any other ideas you might have to make the system more useful while not compromising it's core functionality.
Any suggestions on how to improve the access method to maintain higher engagement rates with patrons
It's ultimately just a case of how many steps the user needs to take in order to receive the image they paid for; on patreon, it is simply the step of picking a tier and paying for it, and then you have instant access to everything.
It's ultimately just a case of how many steps the user needs to take in order to receive the image t
Gumroad was definitely the first platform I was made aware of to host adult art on that you can get paid for, before even patreon. They have an adult content policy which thankfully explains itself pretty decently what is and isn't allowed. You still have to have your account (and presumably, products) reviewed by their risk team, which sounds like a fairly personal process and might not be the best way to use a solution like mine to get around the risk evaluation for something like that given that gumroad seems to be mainly for digital products specifically, and not services. Apparently you have to make an indeterminate amount of money before your account is even eligible for risk review, so there's always a chance your initial profit could go straight into the void, but unlikely.
I'm not sure if anyone's actually tried to push the envelope with them, and that's probably a good thing. It means they're more likely to be willing to work with artists of various styles than a platform that's under the social microscope.
I would've gone with Gumroad myself if their policy wasn't as clear as it is today, but instead I sell my products through e-junkie, which is a lot more... "DIY" than many of these other services and charges monthly instead of per-sale. Artists like Sqoon and
