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Koorivlf

Please don't unfollow me...

because you're under the illussion that I get validation from it. Unfollow me because you want to

I share my work because I personally want to. It was one of the ways I forced myself to learn and to grow. If you'd like to support the work I'm doing now and beyond, that's great! I am deeply grateful for those who support and like my work which allows me to create/helps me keep going with what I do.

However, I am a vocal person, just not generally on off platforms like these. Death of the artist is a thing but I'm not dead and I don't tend to be dead in my works so there may be messages I put out that you don't like

Feel free to unfollow me because YOU don't want to support the work and words, get notifications for the work or words, etc

If you like the work but don't like the words yet continue to follow me, then you'll have to accept some part of that.

Also if you're a pedo/cub you should speak to a therapist because
1. therapists that connect with you are just good and
2. It's one of those kinks that are not "silly fantasies". Epstein didn't kill himself is a known phrase on the internet for a very specific reason. Not everyone can/will do what someone like an Epstein did, just like not every person goes out and kills people with a lightsaber because they saw starwars, but saying "it's just a fantasy" sure won't stop future Epsteins I can tell ya that much.
Viewed: 164 times
Added: 4 years, 1 month ago
 
Drizzle
4 years ago
Still not seeing arguments against the whole cub thing. No facts, just things you believe. You're also preaching against cub porn on a very much pro cub site. You're going to need facts if you're gonna convince anyone here.

If you're an actual pedo, yes, go see a therapist. Completely agree.

But this *is* fantasy. It's all fake. If you can't tell reality from fantasy, maybe you're the one who needs a therapist.

And was Epstein into cub porn? Cause I missed that...

Koorivlf
4 years ago
-1. this journal is about people are free to unfollow me, in this instance I do not care.
 2. Those are arguments against cub, I just haven't whipped out sources cause again, most of what I've read has basically been a concerned shrug for the conclusions. Again, it's hard to get data on the subject for many reasons, for or against it.
3. If there's better studies I will whip those out or change my mind. However even then, I am unsure if trying to change a pedos mind here would matter because even a simple thing like the definition of pedo gets contested, most likely due to the implication of it which doesn't make the definition untrue, it just means the baggage that comes with said definition.

- Like this, "actual pedo" is just a person who get sexual gratification from children. Cub is just furry children. Pedophilic tendencies = Pedo. So, all cub users that like cub sexually should go to a therapist yes.

- Again, I am wary of the way this is framed. Most people can tell a reality from a fantasy, but that reality and fantasy needs to be discussed or else sometimes fantasy becomes reality. The way many pedos discuss this topic is JUST by saying it's a fantasy and not examining further. Fantasies have actions to them, and that should not be dismissed so easily

- Epstein was a pedo, Cubs are pedos. That's the connection. "hurr hurr, he didn't like cub porn though" is one of those "the community doesn't discuss stuff" reason why I don't trust that the cub community. You felt the need to sidetrack to an irrelevant point. The main difference between Epstien and a Pedo here is that he had the resources to do it and if he hadn't of been stupid about it later in life he could have gotten away with it. Pedos without resources still go through with it and just get caught easier-ish. I'm not saying "all pedos" but I'm certainly saying the culture around stuff like cub doesn't seem ready to stop such predators
Do better
Drizzle
4 years ago
I had a whole thing typed out, but I realised I actually agree with you to a significant extent. Still don't agree on the therapist, but I can admit it's a disorder.

(I'll be generalising a bit here, by 'we' I mean cub proponents)

One thing I would like to touch on is the definition, because it's not actually a simple thing. The common definition is like a catch-all, lumping us in with consumers of child porn and child molesters. So it makes sense we don't like to be called pedos. Especially when you seem to think most pedos are child molesters. Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's how it comes across.

So if you wan't to talk about cub porn, it might help if you don't include the term pedo, even if it is medically correct. It makes your whole stance incredibly aggressive.

" Koorivlf wrote:
The way many pedos discuss this topic is JUST by saying it's a fantasy and not examining further.
That sounds very anecdotal. I do agree that it should be talked about and not just dismissed, though.

And I don't think my Epstein cub comment was irrelevant. It highlights that distinction between fiction and reality.

" Koorivlf wrote:
Fantasies have actions to them
I don't quite understand what you mean. If there's action, doesn't that make it reality? What kind of actions are you talking about?

" Koorivlf wrote:
Epstein was a pedo, Cubs are pedos
really doesn't help. It's a massive generalisation and simplification of a seriously complex topic. It basically ignores everything.

" Koorivlf wrote:
Epstein was a pedo, Cubs are pedos

" Koorivlf wrote:
Pedos without resources still go through with it
Again, it sounds like you think we would all molest children.


Turns out this is still a lot longer than I intened...
Koorivlf
3 years, 11 months ago
I don't think most pedos are child molesters but I also don't think it'd be hard to get most pedos to do the kid diddle with how cp/cub is discussed. You just need the right conditions for those who are already primed basically.

Cub is a much narrower word. So yes, Pedo is a catch-all. I can see how it comes off as aggressive but that also tells me that cub one way to reduce the baggage of the topic when that baggage is [potential child molestation] so it's hard to really be ok with just using the term cub.

" And I don't think my Epstein cub comment was irrelevant. It highlights that distinction between fiction and reality.

If furry children became real due to a science breakthrough, can you honestly tell me cubs wouldn't fuck them? It is a fantasy rn, the substitute for that is real children. If people had the means, the question not be if people would fuck them, it'd be how many.
So yes, the fantasy/reality point misses the main point I was saying

" If there's action, doesn't that make it reality? What kind of actions are you talking about?

When people say "the rich are vampires" No one actually thinks the rich are vampires creatures in the night. What people are saying is that rich people suck the life force out of people, they can turn people into husks or into one of them, they prey on the weak, they are an evil manipulative beings who sometimes live in castles.It is a fantasy word with real world correlations to our reality because the word is just a placeholder for a concept that is transmissible to other people.

Art is just a visual medium of communication that does the same thing. Fantasies are not nothing. They are real things but are not a part of our direct reality. If you have a person drawing an adult fucking a furry kid, that's saying a lot of things like: It's acceptable for a furry kid to be fucked, that it's ok for an adult to be the fucker, that we can pay people to do these sorts of works, etc etc.
TLDR: Fantasies can shape people's morality, future actions, life situation, etc. Someone doesn't need to do something materially irl for fantasy to have a real world effect. It will eventually have a real world effect in some way.

" Again, it sounds like you think we would all molest children.

I think if given the opportunity you can get people to do it ya. I do not think most people will do it due to their environment, restrictions, accessibility, etc. Again, I also do not think the cub community and others like anime cp create spaces in which such things are discouraged but instead are sidetracked.
With anime cp you get phrases like "non practicing map" which implies that they WOULD practice but they currently don't.

If you look into @wild__life on twitter, you can see similar language to maps and this side tracking of the issue and how such language is co-opted and normalized to be turned into a scape goat in which "it's just a fantasy" is one entry point to that conclusion.

Not saying cub porn couldn't always stay a fantasy, not saying all cubs are going to molest children. I'm saying that there doesn't seem to be measures to stop such people and the responses I get on this topic from cubs are generally not reassuring. Yes, a therapist is good at any point, especially for this kink, especially especially while this community stays the way it is


Drizzle
3 years, 11 months ago
This is gonna be disappointing, but I have no interest in continuing a month old argument. Especially since I've had a few since, some on this same topic, and they never achieved anything. I'm at the point where I see all internet arguments as a colossal waste of time and effort.

I haven't even read most of your reply, and I'm sorry, I just can't.

One thing I will say is that that's not what I meant with fantasy. I would bring up the same fantasy argument in defence of shota/loli. It's not about whether it's possible, but whether or not it's real. Think The Bank Job, not Godzilla.
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