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AlexReynard

Top 10 Films Critics Hated (Because They're Idiots)

RottenTomatoes.com has been a miracle for someone like me, who takes in movies like other people take in food and oxygen. Being able to get a consensus rating for films before I go to see them is a big help sometimes in deciding what to see. Especially since they give both a critics' consensus and an audiences' consensus.

But using the site has also done something else for me. It has steadily eroded my faith in the intelligence of movie critics.

The more reviews I've read, the more I've cringed. I see patterns emerging. I see critics who'll gush over the most transparently manufactured Oscar Bait. I see them make excuses for inexcusably lazy, mediocre movies, especially ones aimed at children. I see them base their reviews off of other reviewers, instead of what they're supposed to be reviewing. I see them trash a movie that everyone else likes just to look 'edgy'. I see them fawn over old 'classics' that don't hold up today. And I see them give snotty reviews because a film didn't give them exactly what they expected out of it. ARRRRRRRGH.

Anyway, here are some movies that I've seen get royally shit on, and in my opinion, for unfair reasons. I admit, I am a forgiving guy when it comes to entertainment. But I do my best to judge movies based on 'Does this accomplish what it intends to do?'. If it does, or at least tries its heart out, then I usually like it. Here's some films I seem to be alone in liking.

(BTW, yes I know they're all recent. But then again, RottenTomatoes hasn't been around forever.)

~~~~~

10. Devil (2010)
Tomatometer score: 51%
I was actually surprised to check RottenTomatoes and find that this one's got a score as high as it does. I remember people tearing it apart. I remember it being the punchline of jokes. And of course, a lot of that has to do with the mistaken assumption that it's an M. Night Shyamalan movie. He's become a punchline nowadays, due to his movies steadily decreasing in quality (although the suicide scenes in The Happening were goddamn hilarious). With Devil, all he did was come up with the story. It's written and directed by other dudes.

Another reason I think this one fared badly? People were watching it wrong. While this movie has a twist, it is unimportant. You wanna know who the Devil is? It's the old lady. Yes, I just committed a mortal sin by spoiling a movie. But I think it's justified here. If you spend the whole film fixated on the twist, you miss the actual story, which I think is an interesting one. The film is really about a cop coming to grips with a situation (people dying in an elevator) which he cannot solve by any means he understands. There are things in this film that seem like bad coincidences, until eventually you realize that everything is happening exactly as planned.

Plus, it has an opening scene that, for some reason, really unnerves me. Dunno why. However, I think this one is more 'interesting' than 'good', which is why it's only number ten.


9. Eagle Eye (2008)
Tomatometer score: 28%
I saw the word 'preposterous' pop up so many times in reviews of this film that I thought critics had to have been comparing notes. Yet what I liked about it was how much sense it made.

Now, this is a Shia LeBeouf film. If you hate him, you'll hate this; fair enough. (Me? I have no problem with him. He was great in Disturbia and Holes.) To be honest, you are going to have to ignore some pretty goofy-ass over-the-top action movie stuff to enjoy this film the way it deserves. Because every critic seems to have reviewed this movie as an action flick. And as an action flick, it's sub par. But as a sci fi flick, which is what it's SUPPOSED to be, it has some brilliant writing.

There's a scene in the beginning where Shia's on a train coming home, and on the news the anchor mentions that today the government gave itself the ability to use anyone's cell phone as a listening device at any time for any reason. And no one in the train car gives the slightest shit. Now THAT is satire. When I saw that, I realized this was a movie I needed to pay attention to.

I love a villain with a good motivation, and this movie has a doozy. Critics howled over how overcomplicated the villain's plot is, without ever realizing something incredibly simple: all the crazy, convoluted things that happen in this film were not planned out ahead of time. The villain is constantly changing their plan as they go along, adapting to every new circumstance. When do you ever see that in a film!? And when you finally find out their motivation, it's chilling because they are 100% correct. Chillingly, heartlessly correct. Watch it and see.


8. The Amityville Horror (2005)
Tomatometer score: 24%
Here's a movie where I want you to do the exact opposite of what I suggested with the last one. With this movie, you can pretty much ignore everything but the characters. This film feels like it was shat out without thought by a studio that just wanted to produce a mediocre little CGI-laden horror film that would bring in a smidge more than its budget. Except the actors decided to sabotage the film by turning in really good performances.

Seriously, everyone's good in this. They don't have to be, but they are. Ryan Reynolds is goddamn creepy, because you watch him slowly turn from a stepfather who is doing his best to love his children, into an absolute monster. There's a scene where he's chopping wood with his stepson that made my skin crawl. Plus, the normally-forgettable role of the cute little girl is played by the too-amazing-for-her-age Chloe Grace Moretz. Yeah, Hit Girl. She takes a nothing role and acts her fucking heart out with it.

So, laugh at the ultra cheap computer effects and the pointlessly overexplained revelations about the house. Watch this for a damn good performance of a family going through hell. (Also, there's a cute little ghost girl in it who has a scene so badass I dare not say a single word but FINGER.)


7. The Box (2009)
Tomatometer score: 45%
I guess I can understand people not liking this film for it being too complicated. It is complicated. But if you're willing to devote some attention and brainpower to it, it is absolutely worth it. This is a film made by the guy who did Donnie Darko. It's just as bizarro and filled with brain twisting sci-fi ideas, yet it's also achingly personal and sad. It has a unique, misty, dreamlike look to it too.

The setup comes from a Twilight Zone episode: a woman is given a box with a button on it, and told by a mysterious stranger that if she pushes it, she'll get one million dollars, and someone she does not know will die. The twist ending where the Twilight Zone episode ended is where this movie really begins. The movie delves into who is behind the box, why they're doing this, the consequences of making the wrong choice, the faults of human mortality, and whether or not we are inherently doomed as a species. It may take several viewings, but as 'Rube Goldberg' as this film gets, I honestly think everything in it is explained. Watch it once to be shocked by where it goes, then watch it again to see how everything led there.


6. Miss March (2009)
Tomatometer score: 5%
Have you ever seen any episodes of The Whitest Kids U Know? They're a sketch comedy quintet who do very subversive, meta-type humor. It's not for everyone. Which is why it was especially stupid for a movie studio to come to two of its stars with a repulsively mediocre gross-out buddy comedy script and ask them to direct it. At first they refused. But then they got drunk and realized how fun it would be to intentionally sabotage it. (The movie Hot Rod happened the same way, BTW.)

This movie is itself a giant joke. It is a parody of a godawful comedy, disguised as what it is. That means the humor is either subtle as heck, or crossing the line twice. If you've seen crappy-ass comedies about college guys on a road trip trying to get pussy and having wacky adventures, you will recognize every cliche they mercilessly fart on. This is not a serious film. It's two guys making a terrible movie while laughing their asses off that they're getting paid to make a terrible movie. Personally, I love watching stupid movies made by smart people. Maybe I'm weird.

Plus, it has a character named Horsedick.MPEG. He is a rapper. He has a hit single named "Suck My Dick While I Fuck Your Ass". If you don't see the beauty in that, this movie is not for you.


5. In Time (2011)
Tomatometer score: 39%
Yes, this came out just days ago, but I honestly think it deserves its place on this list. My blood boiled when I read the reviews, seeing every last one of them miss the entire point of the movie.

It's an ALLEGORY, goddammit! Is that too hard a concept for your brain to handle? No? Then congratulations, you are smarter than a movie critic. It seems stupidly obvious, but apparently it isn't. In this movie time literally is money. This movie is an economics lesson cleverly disguised as a sci-fi action flick so people will go see it.

I often see people discussing complicated topics in a way that suggests they think everyone else knows just as much about the subject as they do. When it comes to economics, I know almost nothing. Yet this movie took some very complicated concepts and made them comprehensible to me. This movie conveys its message effectively to the people who most need to learn it. And miraculously, it doesn't condescend either. It assumes you are smart enough to follow the metaphor. It simplifies ideas without dumbing them down.

Simply put, if you don't quite know what the Occupy Wall Street protests are about, go see this movie and you'll understand everything. I am completely serious. It shows you the immorality of a system where a few have more than they could ever use, while most are living day to day and dying in the streets. Even more impressively, it knows where to place blame. The bad guys are the people who knowingly keep the system going; not the people who are given shitty wages to perpetuate it, or even those who benefit from it by an accident of birth. I love it when the more I think about a movie afterwards, the more I keep noticing little details that impress me.

Plus, the cars are really cool-looking.


4. The Matrix Revolutions (2003)
Tomatometer score: 36%
Let's get this out of the way: I HATED this movie when I first saw it. I felt betrayed by it. The first Matrix changed the way movies looked forever. The second one was badmouthed for its weak story, but I understood that it was all building up to something (plus the action sequences are beyond excellent). Then the third film comes along and seems to piss on everything we liked about the first two. It's action scenes are weak, and it seems like no one in it will shut up about philosophy.

Except that, years later, when I decided to give it another chance, I made the accidentally perfect decision to watch it and Matrix Reloaded back-to-back in one sitting.

Suddenly, I LOVED Revolutions.

Everything made sense now. Imagine hearing half of a joke, then waiting till next year to hear the other half. Will it be funny? Of course not. The Matrix Trilogy is simply not a trilogy: It's two movies, one of which happens to be extremely long. Watching both halves together creates a complete movie. I remembered all the setup from Reloaded, so it all paid off in Revolutions. And yes, some of the action scenes are still weak. But I realized they aren't the point. This movie has a ton of philosophy in it. Deep stuff that Hollywood normally never touches. If you pay attention to it instead of just waiting for them to do more bullet-time fighting, it's mind-blowing. Even if I may not agree with the movie's Buddhist-themed morals, I admire how different they are from what we usually see. In what other action movie can you think of where the hero realizes that the only way to win his greatest battle is to stop fighting it?

(BTW, I still hate that they killed Trinity. I understand the purpose it served in the story, but it still felt contrived. If she had to die, I would have much rather seen her go out fighting in a blaze of ballsiness.)


3. Freddy Got Fingered (2001)
Tomatometer score: 11%
You are meant to hate this movie. That is the most important thing about it.

I understood as soon as I started watching it that it was intended as a work of Dada art. Or if that's too obscure for you, Tom Green was trolling every movie critic in America, and he got exactly the reaction he wanted.

Don't believe me? Think about it. That was his entire schtick. Not since Andy Kaufman has a performer so thoroughly embraced the concept of 'punish your audience'. Back when FGF came out, there were a ton of dumbass comedies that all tried to out-shock each other in the gross humor department. Tom Green advertised his film as more of the same, then proceeded to screw every single person who bought a ticket.

This movie is designed to frustrate your expectations. Whenever you see a typical setup, Tom kicks the seat out from under you and does something either cringingly unfunny or genuinely nauseating. The humor in the movie is knowing what it's making fun of. Knowing that it's being nails-on-a-chalkboard irritating on purpose. Every critic loathed this movie with a passion, and Tom Green just giggled. Notice that on the movie poster, he's composing a shot, but looking at us. Our reaction is the real movie.

Want proof that this was brilliant faux-awfulness instead of real awfulness? When Freddy is sent to a state home for sexually abused children, in one scene we see them watching TV. What's on? The original Texas Chainsaw Massacre. That is fucking genius.


2. Speed Racer (2008)
Tomatometer score: 38%
How can anyone not like this movie? HOW can anyone not like this movie!? If you're elderly or epileptic, then fine; I understand. But I loved the everliving heck out of this film. I was blown away by it. It turned me into a grinning little kid again.

Every critic who said this film's plot was too complicated is stupid. Every critic who said this film focuses too much on the special effects and not on the characters is stupid. This movie is as heartfelt and straightforward as any I've ever seen. It has a cartoon's sense of reality and morality. If you can't get in tune with that, then oh well. But I could. Yes, it's a world where people drive insanely futuristic cars that can defy physics, but the characters in it take it seriously because it's their world.

Beyond that, the amount of heart and soul poured into this movie is astronomical. Its creativity is off the charts. Yet it respects the original cartoon so much it even duplicates a few scenes shot-for-shot. Yeah, it's hard to tell what's going on sometimes, but I never had any trouble following the story, and I suspect a kid wouldn't either. I swear, there are colors in this movie that had never existed before anywhere in the galaxy. The vehicles are brain-damagingly awesome. The casting is perfect. The dialogue is smart. The music is exuberant. The final race is the most nerve-explodingly exciting adrenaline rush I think I've ever seen.

But you can ignore all that, because none of it matters. What does matter? When I saw this in the theater, during the final race a little boy in the back jumped out of his seat and yelled, "Go Speed!!!" Really. He is the only critic whose opinion on this film matters, I think.


1. Sucker Punch (2011)
Tomatometer score: 23%
People who hate this movie are fucktards.

I said it and I'm not apologizing. Sucker Punch has to be the most misunderstood movie I've ever seen. I froth at the mouth when I read reviews for it. Even the good ones! ALL of them miss the mark. NONE of them see past the visuals to what the movie's actually about. For fuck's sakes, virtually every criticism I see of this movie is what THE MOVIE ITSELF IS TRYING TO CRITICIZE!!!

If this movie is a failure, it's only real failing is its inability to effectively convey its message. And yes, I admit that's kind of a huge failing. I'm a guy who watches a lot of movies, and not to brag, but I rarely have any trouble at all understanding them. With Sucker Punch, I did have to do some reading about it afterwards before I got it. But when I did, I spent hours going over every inch of it in my mind, shitting myself from seeing just how deep the rabbit hole went.

I'm going to spoil some things here because it'll be easier to understand Sucker Punch if you know some stuff beforehand. First off, the trailers were a lure that worked too well. The insane action sequences were meant to draw in exactly the kind of audience the movie was most harshly criticizing. Unfortunately, critics seem to have focused only on the visuals and ignored everything else.

The action sequences are all meaningless. Literally. This movie is about Hollywood's treatment of women, using disassociation from reality as a technique. Baby Doll, the main character, is sent to a mental hospital by her unimaginably evil father. Unable to deal with her trauma, she reimagines the asylum as a brothel, making the sexual abuse of the patients by the staff more palatable. Baby Doll discovers that she has a gift for dance, and is soon dancing to distract the staff so she and four other girls can make an escape. But in her mind, Baby Doll's dancing becomes a series of fantastic sci-fi worlds, all jumbled up like dreams. And that's all they are. In the end, her dreams; her dances, do not save them. They accomplish nothing.

Critics said this movie did not empower women. That it was just a bunch of scantily-clad women jumping about, doing 'action grrl' stuff while their tits flopped around. YES. THAT'S THE FUCKING POINT. The point is that these kinds of roles for women offer the illusion of empowerment, nothing more. It's no different than pole dancing, the director is saying. And while men leer at Baby Doll during her dances, the audience leers at her during her action fantasies. This movie is an enormous middle finger to juvenile nerds. Sadly, the hollow, spectacle-without-substance action scenes were enjoyed unironically by the very people the movie was trying to piss off.

And the ending... Jesus Christ, it is a mindfuck of unfathomable proportions. Fair warning: 'Sucker Punch' is a very appropriate title.

Maybe Zak Snyder just assumed everyone was smarter than they were. My hunch is that he had a ton of ideas for Sucker Punch, then made the film in a white heat before he fully understood them and how to effectively convey them. If he'd spent a few years reworking the script, this could have been a masterpiece. It's still a movie that is desperately trying to say something that its audience does not want to hear. And just for trying, I think it deserves recognition.





Bonus: My Soul To Take (2010)
Tomatometer score: 9%
This didn't make the list because it really is a bad movie. But it is a bad movie so jaw droppingly strange that you really ought to give it a chance.

This is a movie Wes Craven spent five years on, and it seems impossible. It is more uneven than an ocean of mashed potatoes. There are characters who have surprising depth and interesting personalities, yet who say bizarrely inhuman lines of dialogue. There's a slasher who feels thrown in as an afterthought, even though the movie's supposedly about him. There is a scene with a condor costume that seriously must be seen to be believed. There is a genuinely surprising plot twist that had no relevance to the plot whatsoever.The ending is about twenty minutes of nothing but expository dialogue, and yet I thought it was genuinely gripping and suspenseful.

Just an example: One character is a girl who eats, sleeps and breathes Jesus. You know exactly how this character will act from all the times she's shown up in other movies. Except you don't. Here, she's sunny and forgiving and completely sincere. I absolutely loved her. That boggles my damn mind.

It's like with Sucker Punch: Wes seems to have had a gajillion ideas for this thing, but he threw them all together in a blender. He needed someone to help him co-write this thing. Watching it is fascinating for the potential it has, and all the weird, weird, weird things it does instead.

This is what eventually convinced me to see it:

In one scene, the rapey jock guy is talking to his cheerleader girlfriend on the phone. She owes him a favor, so he says, "How 'bout a blowjob?"

She replies, "How 'bout I have my dog bite it off and bury it in my backyard?"

Then, after she hangs up, the jock guy stares off into the fourth wall and says, completely deadpan, "How big is your backyard?"

WHAT THE FUUUUUUUUUUCK!?!?




(If you guys want me to, I might do a list of my top 10 critically-acclaimed films I couldn't give a crap about.)
Viewed: 290 times
Added: 6 years, 10 months ago
 
HimaChita
6 years, 10 months ago
Wow, I really like an lot of movies in that like, it's an real shame that critics shit on movies like these. One more that I would add to that list from my own favorites would be 'Lady in the Water' as I feel that one is unjustfully criticized too, but great points on your full list.
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>I would add to that list from my own favorites would be 'Lady in the Water' as I feel that one is unjustfully criticized too, but great points on your full list.

I think that one deserves some criticism for being so pretentious. I mean, casting yourself as the Messiah is kind of tacky. But I liked Paul Giamati, and the film critic guy, and the interesting ideas about story itself. I liked the switcheroo at the end when you discover what everyone's roles really are.
Winterimage
6 years, 10 months ago
Sad to say, I've only seen Matrix Revolutions out of these, and I think it deserved all the poor reviews it got and then some. Otherwise, I have a very high tolerance for movies that others hate.

I'd love to see the critically-acclaimed list.
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>Sad to say, I've only seen Matrix Revolutions out of these, and I think it deserved all the poor reviews it got and then some.

<shrug> If you hate it for what it is, that's totally fair. I'm just saying, I think it suffered from how it was presented. Kinda like how the Back To The Future movies have a TON of little connections that are difficult to see unless you watch them all close together.

>I'd love to see the critically-acclaimed list.

I'm not sure I have a full ten yet. There are quite a few on it that I watched and I thought they were good, but I couldn't understand why they were considered classics.
Winterimage
6 years, 10 months ago
I didn't exactly hate it, but I thought it was a weak ending to the series. The first one is a classic, the second is okay, the third was too over the top. So many scenes that were supposed to be so dramatic and action-filled, that it became too much.

As for, BttF 3 is a really good movie, and part 2 is fully watchable. All in all I'd say they form a more coherent trilogy that the Matrix movies.
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>I didn't exactly hate it, but I thought it was a weak ending to the series.

I can understand that. But again, I'm judging it by 'Did it do what it intended to do?', and once I understood it, I realized that Revolutions was what everything was always leading to. I think the Wachowskis tried to start out with a standard action-type movie to get people's attention, get into some more philosophy in the second, and then bring it all together in the third. The problem was, they did the action so well, that's all anyone wanted more of. (Me included.)

>As for, BttF 3 is a really good movie, and part 2 is fully watchable. All in all I'd say they form a more coherent trilogy that the Matrix movies.

Agreed. I didn't catch every single connection between them the first time I watched them, but it didn't take me almost a decade to understand the third film either. ;)
Rakaziel
6 years, 10 months ago
Reads very interesting. You got me make a list of which movies I am going to rent in the next time and half of them are definitely on it: Eagle Eye, The Box, In Time, Speed Racer, Sucker Punch and My Soul To Take. The others also objectively sound good but subjectively are not my taste.

I can think of four movies that may be not on this list (I do not know the opinion of the critics on them) but that could definitely interest you.
Tamala 2010,
Mindgame and
Genius Party are Japanese animated movies (Genius Party being a collection of short movies, all of which are good, by different regisseurs, one of whom also made Mindgame) and
Gothic is a very atmospheric 80s horror movie (even better when you watch it in one sitting with Bram Stoker's Dracula, with Gothic as the second course)

AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>The others also objectively sound good but subjectively are not my taste.

That's totally okay. A lot of ones on my 'critics liked them; I didn't' list are ones where I thought they were good, but they simply weren't my kind of movie.

>Tamala 2010

Read the synopses of that. Holy shit, gotta see it ASAP. :3

>Mindgame

OMFG, MINDGAME WAS AMAZING!!! I loved the hell out of it. I could rewatch the inflatable-boob cat dance part a million times.

>Gothic is a very atmospheric 80s horror movie (even better when you watch it in one sitting with Bram Stoker's Dracula, with Gothic as the second course)

I've been meaning to see Dracula anyway, since I heard ALL of its special effects were done in-camera. The very concept blows my mind.
ScottyKat
6 years, 10 months ago
Seems like i have some movies to watch..
Ever think of being a movie critic? XD
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
If I was a real movie critic, I'd have to watch all the new movies that come out. Eek. There are a LOT of films I intentionally do not watch.
ScottyKat
6 years, 10 months ago
lol true *snug*
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
If I had to sit through stuff like The Smurfs, I'd feel dirty for getting paid for it. :P

At least when I watch the Alvin & The Chipmunks movies, it's because I fap to them! ;D
ScottyKat
6 years, 10 months ago
LOL they'ed HAVE to pay me to get me to watch new smurfs. XD
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
On the other hand, I just saw a trailer for the new Chipmunks movie. OMFG, it looks like it will have even more Chipette stealth porn than the second one did! ^__^
ScottyKat
6 years, 10 months ago
Oh my god they're doing lady gaga. and yes.. .so much munkporn
Humbug
6 years, 10 months ago
I'm glad to see Speed Racer on there. It's one of the two I've actually seen (the other being Matrix Revolutions of course), and when I watched it, I knew most people wouldn't get why it's awesome. We'll ignore that the movie was produced in an industry rife with just the kinds of things the villain was doing (Why do you think so many Oscar-seeking movies get Oscars? Someone's palms have gotta be getting greased), but it had a nice, simple, moral story and fun characters. And yes, it didn't take itself seriously at all as a movie, even if the characters were dead-serious about everything going on, which is what made it so fun. Kinda the same thing as Scott Pilgrim, honestly, which was also panned by critics.

Either way, yeah. A lot of people just don't "get" certain types of movies, which is unfortunate because usually they're the best ones. :)
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>We'll ignore that the movie was produced in an industry rife with just the kinds of things the villain was doing

Gooooood point.

Also, was he totally channeling Christopher Hitchens or what?

>And yes, it didn't take itself seriously at all as a movie, even if the characters were dead-serious about everything going on,

I guess people couldn't get into that. Me, I like that in a movie.

>Kinda the same thing as Scott Pilgrim, honestly, which was also panned by critics.

Actually, it has an 81% Tomatometer score. I've not met anyone who says they didn't like it, it just seems to have been marketed very badly. I think they should have hyped the fact that it was made by the guy who did Shaun Of The Dead and Hot Fuzz.

>A lot of people just don't "get" certain types of movies, which is unfortunate because usually they're the best ones. :)

Something I love seeing is a film where the director is doing something straight from their heart and they don't give a fuck what anyone else has to say. A lot of these movies bomb, but I love their enthusiasm.
Humbug
6 years, 10 months ago
>Also, was he totally channeling Christopher Hitchens or what?

Totally. :D

>Actually, it has an 81% Tomatometer score. I've not met anyone who says they didn't like it, it just seems to have been marketed very badly. I think they should have hyped the fact that it was made by the guy who did Shaun Of The Dead and Hot Fuzz.

It's even that high with the critics? Maybe I'm just thinking stuffy ol' Roger Ebert then. I know there were plenty of fans and such, myself among them, but I thought the critics pretty much hated it.

>Something I love seeing is a film where the director is doing something straight from their heart and they don't give a fuck what anyone else has to say. A lot of these movies bomb, but I love their enthusiasm.
Absolutely. Shame there isn't much money in those sorts of things. :<
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>Totally. :D

I wonder if Hitch ever saw the movie and Was Not Amused, or if he laughed his ass off?

>It's even that high with the critics? Maybe I'm just thinking stuffy ol' Roger Ebert then. I know there were plenty of fans and such, myself among them, but I thought the critics pretty much hated it.

Ebert's weird sometimes. Normally I love him, but every once in a while he'll do a review that's very 'I'm a crotchety Grandpa'.
Humbug
6 years, 10 months ago
> I wonder if Hitch ever saw the movie and Was Not Amused, or if he laughed his ass off.

Yyyyeah, who knows? Probably has more important things to worry about. Like religion. He's into that stuff, right?

> Ebert's weird sometimes. Normally I love him, but every once in a while he'll do a review that's very 'I'm a crotchety Grandpa'.

Undahstood. :)
skunktronix
6 years, 10 months ago
I saw "In Time" last night. Understood the metaphors perfectly. :)
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
<shakes head> I was dumbfounded when I looked over the RottenTomatoes reviews and didn't see a single mention of Occupy Wall Street. It all seemed like they were reviewing it as a straight sci-fi flick. How!?
skunktronix
6 years, 10 months ago
Do you think it'd be fair to say that "In Time" has some similarities to the Robin Hood story?
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
Certainly. But I think it's even more similar to Bonnie & Clyde.
ZephonTsol
6 years, 10 months ago
I still think that The Green Lantern was given a bad shake by critics and for the reasons you listed. Ryan Reynolds really *is* a good actor and he delivered a solid performance in it, the CGI was not as brain-bendingly bad as everyone said (if you need an example of bad CGI...well...look at early CGI films and see just how far we've come and just how jaded people are in their current expectations of it).

But the point here is that one person said it was bad. Then it was an avalanche of critics and internet-reviewers (the type who think they're famous, but really aren't) bashing on it in surprisingly fanatical fashion, their reviews ever-increasing in snark and sneer at just how bad it was. In my mind, it reminded me of Speed Racer for pretty much all the same reasons. GL is a character whose power comes from sheer imagination. This movie, therefore, has a core about it of fun and excitement. And yet, all they can bang on about is how it either was too much CGI or 'wasn't faithful to the comics waaaaaah'.

It's the review of this movie that has caused me to take a massive amount of salt with any review by any self-proclaimed critic. It's not bad. It's not stellar either, but it's a damned decent watch.
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>I still think that The Green Lantern was given a bad shake by critics and for the reasons you listed.

I will very likely see it eventually. Partly because Ryan impresses me as an actor (Did you see Buried? Holy shit!!), but because you give it such a strong recommend. :)

>(if you need an example of bad CGI...well...look at early CGI films and see just how far we've come and just how jaded people are in their current expectations of it).

I can accept that maybe the trailer just made it look bad. I still don't know how it's possible, but when I saw the Rise Of The Planet Of The Apes trailer, the CG looked horrible. Then in the actual movie, it was excellent. WTF!?

>It's not stellar either, but it's a damned decent watch.

In Time is not a magnificent movie either. But like I said, I judge movies by whether they accomplish what they intend to do. In that sense, I think In Time is a perfect movie, because it did exactly what it tried to. Another thing I don't like about critics is that it's stupid to judge a sci-fi film, or a horror, or a comedy, or a superhero movie, by the standards of an Oscar-winning drama. There's more than one standard of 'good'.
ElMatto
6 years, 10 months ago
Miss March was fucking hilarious!
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
"Lesbians... I didn't want to say anything, but the car is really starting to smell."
Shuyo
6 years, 10 months ago
Miss March was funny as shit.

AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
I admit, I laughed my ass off at him trying to get the dog to pee in the champagne glass.
Relee
6 years, 10 months ago
You know, looking at this something occured to me.

Why in the hell don't you have a show on YouTube?

You've got these great, well thought out and controversial oppinions, you have a bombastic personality full of highs and lows of joy and fury, you have a great appearance, and you talk on skype and splice transformers movies so I know you have the equipment and skills to do it.

I know you like that Atheist guy. You could be like him! You could be the anti Nostalgia Critic, loving on things people hated. You're taller than him, you know? He's a little guy.

I don't know if you wanna do something like that, but you should do it anyways. It's like, it's your fricking DESTINY man!


Oh and I finally got around to watching that copy of Bartok the Magnificent you sent me. That movie was fun, though a lot of it didn't make sense. Everybody was okay with the talking animals, but they were the only talking animals in the film, and they all bought the bear's rampage, but if they learned he was civilized it would mean trouble. Bartok takes almost no convincing to actually go on that adventure, and it seems almost as bizzare that the bear thought it was a good idea. All through it, Bartok is like a fricking saint. I can appreciate that, I like saintly characters, and it was FUN, but his courage went beyond heroic into just unbelievable. It's like, he's a hero now? How was he not a hero before?

Pilof was awesome. I can see why you liked her. Her situation was kind of bizzare though. Why in the hell was she stuck out there to begin with? She's a great character anyways. Lots of fun.

The whole movie was fun, like I said, but the story just felt cheap.

Oh yeah and the voice actors were great. Almost as great as the game Sacrifice.
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>Why in the hell don't you have a show on YouTube?

All your reasons are flattering and I appreciate them, but the simple fact is, I don't have a decent camera yet. And I prefer writing. As much as I enjoy doing little essay-things like this, I don't want them to become all I do. Back when I was on FA, I started really getting into my Montroversies, and my regular writing took a backseat. I'd rather be less of a celebrity and write furry novels. The world already has plenty of 'internet opinion guys'.

>Oh and I finally got around to watching that copy of Bartok the Magnificent you sent me. That movie was fun, though a lot of it didn't make sense.

Indeed. I honestly think that Bluth has really vivid dreams, then makes movies out of them. Rock-A-Doodle seems proof enough.

>Pilof was awesome. I can see why you liked her.

I especially liked that a character like he could have so easily been annoying as fuck. Yet her voice actor keeps her from being shrill and over-perky, and she's just pure concentrated joy instead. ^__^

>Why in the hell was she stuck out there to begin with?

I have absolutely no idea. I've wondered that myself.

>Oh yeah and the voice actors were great. Almost as great as the game Sacrifice.

I saw that as 'Scarface' at first. >.<
Relee
6 years, 10 months ago
>>Why in the hell don't you have a show on YouTube?

>All your reasons are flattering and I appreciate them, but the simple fact is, I don't have a decent camera yet. And I prefer writing. As much as I enjoy doing little essay-things like this, I don't want them to become all I do. Back when I was on FA, I started really getting into my Montroversies, and my regular writing took a backseat. I'd rather be less of a celebrity and write furry novels. The world already has plenty of 'internet opinion guys'.


You can do it with a crap camera! You wouldn't be the first. It would get you started! ^.^

Your writing is great and we all love it. It's too bad you don't have more time! You took the time to write these reviews though, and you take time to do aural presentations with Ebuddy and Kanadada, so doing something like this in front of a camera wouldn't be that much of a stretch.


>>Oh and I finally got around to watching that copy of Bartok the Magnificent you sent me. That movie was fun, though a lot of it didn't make sense.

>Indeed. I honestly think that Bluth has really vivid dreams, then makes movies out of them. Rock-A-Doodle seems proof enough.


I like a lot of his movies though. Rock-a-doodle and A Troll in Central Park come to mind. Well, I guess that's a given since they both have great transformations...


>>Pilof was awesome. I can see why you liked her.

>I especially liked that a character like he could have so easily been annoying as fuck. Yet her voice actor keeps her from being shrill and over-perky, and she's just pure concentrated joy instead. ^__^


Yeah she did a great job on that. Her voice was strange and really very great.


>>Oh yeah and the voice actors were great. Almost as great as the game Sacrifice.

>I saw that as 'Scarface' at first. >.<


Sacrifice is a video game with a lot of really good voice actors.
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>You can do it with a crap camera! You wouldn't be the first. It would get you started! ^.^

My webcam doesn't record. Hence, problem. I have a digital camera, but it records without sound for some reason. :/

>Your writing is great and we all love it. It's too bad you don't have more time! You took the time to write these reviews though, and you take time to do aural presentations with Ebuddy and Kanadada, so doing something like this in front of a camera wouldn't be that much of a stretch.

I think I'd rather spend time doing stuff for a few friends than a wide audience.

>I like a lot of his movies though. Rock-a-doodle and A Troll in Central Park come to mind. Well, I guess that's a given since they both have great transformations...

Kanada showed me the troll boy bit in that. Was pretty cool. I also liked the kids-to-monkeys in We're Back. It seems impossible that that one's not a Bluth film.

>Sacrifice is a video game with a lot of really good voice actors.

Brad Garrett and Tim Curryvoiced two GODS!? Now that is some awesome casting. :)
Relee
6 years, 10 months ago
The Tim Curry god is an air tank with a balloon for a head with a face drawn on it. ^.^;;

I'm not sure the name of the guy who plays the main character's voice but he's pretty darn good. I hear him in a lot of cartoons. The one that comes to mind is the grandfather from Ben 10, but he's played a lot more important roles than that.

Sorry if I'm twisting your arm too much on the youtube show thing. I just think you'd be perfect, but time is limited and you've gotta do what you feel is important. <3
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>Sorry if I'm twisting your arm too much on the youtube show thing. I just think you'd be perfect, but time is limited and you've gotta do what you feel is important. <3

I'm not against the idea, just a little worried about it. I just don't wanna start doing it and get in a rut. Like, the videos are all I'm doing. When I feel like I have to do something, the fun goes right out of it.
Relee
6 years, 10 months ago
Well, it won't be a regular series then. Just a whenever thing. ^.^
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
Unfortunately, I know myself well enough to know it'd start out like that, but it'd quickly grow to dominate my schedule. I'm like that. :/
Relee
6 years, 10 months ago
Yeah, you are. ;.;

*space hugs*
FedoraFox
6 years, 10 months ago
You make some interesting points and I think your point on Sucker Punch will make me wanna see it. I've heard a variety of opinions from my friends have seen it ranging from "HOLY SHIT THIS MOVIE'S AWESOME!" to "Meh, it was okay" to "It wasn't even a decent popcorn flick". Better put that on my backlog of films.

Also, two questions: A.)"Are there any known movie critics you do respect?" and 2.) "Would you do a list on movies you hate, but critics like?"
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>You make some interesting points and I think your point on Sucker Punch will make me wanna see it.

Just keep in mind that it's very not a popcorn flick. My friend & I watched it a few days ago, and he thought what I did: the action scenes get boring after a while. Because they're supposed to. They're pointless shiny nonsense. The real plot is what you should pay attention to. And see it with other people. This is a movie where a lot of my enjoyment came from talking about it afterwards.

>A.)"Are there any known movie critics you do respect?

I like roger Ebert most of the time, because he's good about judging movies by other movies of their kind; something doesn't have to be Oscar-worthy for him to like it. Plus there's this one guy on RT I keep seeing, who often reviews horror movies, and has a soft spot for good, fun trash like I do.

>2.) "Would you do a list on movies you hate, but critics like?

I'm working on it. I don't think i have a full ten yet.
Alfador
6 years, 10 months ago
" ...or epileptic


BWAHAHA YES. Also I have heard that the way the world is all in bright colors and stylized shapes, yet totally real(istic), is the way one sees things on certain hallucinogens. Which a) means I never have to experiment with such chemicals, as I can just watch Speed Racer again... and b) inspires questions of just what the movie would look like whilst ON such drugs...

AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>Which a) means I never have to experiment with such chemicals, as I can just watch Speed Racer again...

I can't imagine drugs could affect me any more than Frank Zappa music already does. ;)

>and b) inspires questions of just what the movie would look like whilst ON such drugs...

I imagine the TV would start melting into the walls.
DisneyCub
6 years, 10 months ago
A lot of people really seem to hate the live-action Grinch for some reason.
Kanada
6 years, 10 months ago
a couple of films that come to mind in this theme so far...

"Constantine"
---if you divorce the film entirely from its source material, you have a really good flick with some excellent acting and easily one of the best depictions of the devil put to film.

"Avp: Requiem."
---this movie does suck. the skip button helps quite a bit in making a cut of this thing that focuses solely on the lead predator and his quest to clean up the mess from the last movie's stinger.

"Alien Resurrection"
---guilty pleasure by far. proto-firefly fun. its very detached from the other 3 films (and coming off of alien3's dour tone, this one looks  sunny and comedic in comparison) and the change to the Ripley character is jarring (basically she is not really the same character). but i still find myself watching it when its on tv. and enjoying it.

"The Butterfly Effect"
---this is well acted dispute the fact Aston Kutcher is involved. conceptually it's great and playing with the alternate universes is wonderful as fuck.
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>Constantine

That movie made me want to go see everything Peter Stormare had ever done. I noticed he seemed to get semi-popular for a while after if came out.

>Avp: Requiem.

Plus, that egg-laying scene was kinda stealth porn...

>Alien Resurrection

It's definitely a weird movie, but I thought it was inventive, had good dialogue and characters, and just looked really interesting.

>The Butterfly Effect

I definitely would have added this to the list if I'd remembered it.
ProjectDemise
6 years, 10 months ago
Make the list!
randomfox
6 years, 10 months ago
To this day I do not understand why people don't like Sucker Punch. Everyone I know who has seen it hated it, even my cousin who saw it with me (admittedly we have vastly different tastes in movies) but when I saw it I fucking loved it. I'm one of those crazy peoples who thinks about stuff a lot in a lot of different ways, and I was really amazed by how much Sucker Punch was trying to say. When I first saw it I thought it to be a female version of Scott Pilgrim VS The World, but over time I digested it a bit more and likened it to tons of other cerebral mindfuck media: Requiem for a Dream, The Matrix, Arkham Asylum: a Serious House on Serious Earth. (to be fair that last one is a comic book) It's one of those movies where I can watch it a ton of different times and never fail to find new stuff. To be honest I don't know WHAT people were expected, since personally I try to not have any expectations at all when going into something be it a new movie or game or what have you, but whatever they were looking for and couldn't find I can't imagine it was better then what was there. Hopefully history will vindicate it, since hey Wizard of Oz was a box office failure when it first came out, but yeah kind of a drag for most of these movies. One wouldn't think you'd need a better argument for popularity=/=quality then the success of the Transformers movies, but there it is.
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>To this day I do not understand why people don't like Sucker Punch.

Admittedly, I can see how someone could dislike it just for having such a downer ending. I normally don't like those myself, but at least the one in sucker Punch had meaning.

>likened it to tons of other cerebral mindfuck media: Requiem for a Dream

I gotta see that one of these days...

>Arkham Asylum: a Serious House on Serious Earth.

Read that. Didn't like it. Still not sure why. I think that I felt the philosophy just didn't fit a Batman story; that he changed the characters too much. <shrug>

>One wouldn't think you'd need a better argument for popularity=/=quality then the success of the Transformers movies,

Twilight. ;)
Felixpath
6 years, 10 months ago
Good list! I liked The Box quite a bit; it felt incomplete, but so did Donnie Darko, and that film has a ginormous cult following. Maybe it was a film of failed ambition, but at least it HAD SOMETHING TO SAY, unlike most movies these days. And when I saw Sucker Punch at number one, I offered a small prayer of thanks to heaven. Why did people hate that film so much? Because it's somehow unacceptable for Zack Snyder, a man, to make a movie about the exploitation of women? Because the movie's designed to make the viewer feel guilty and uncomfortable for getting turned on? As opposed to just mindlessly offering hot young women up like bacon sandwiches? Plus, it looked cool and was badass.

I love lists like this, that serve to remind us all that film critics do not get to decide which movies are good and which are bad. Been wanting to do one of my own...
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>I liked The Box quite a bit; it felt incomplete, but so did Donnie Darko, and that film has a ginormous cult following.

Yeah; I didn't get why Darko took off and this one didn't. Also, how many times have you seen it? I didn' think it felt incomplete at all, probably because when I saw it a second time, I saw how all sorts of seemingly random stuff all had a purpose.

>Why did people hate that film so much? Because it's somehow unacceptable for Zack Snyder, a man, to make a movie about the exploitation of women?

DING DING DING! I saw pretty much that exact attitude from a lot of feminists (although they didn't admit to it). Because he's a man, then obviously he can't possibly know anything about women and he just made this movie to exploit them. Ugh.

>Because the movie's designed to make the viewer feel guilty and uncomfortable for getting turned on?

Yeah. I watched this with a friend and he admitted that he kinda wanted to fap to the film just to spite it.

On the other hand, I didn't quite think the film was bashing men getting turned on. He was just making the point that skimpy-clothed action girl stuff ain't any different from pole dancing, so don't act like it's anything but. Seeing it a second time, I wasn't sure whether Dr. Gorski was a well-meaning feminist who thought the dance really was helping, or if she was just trying to help the girls find some small piece of joyful expression in an awful situation.

>As opposed to just mindlessly offering hot young women up like bacon sandwiches?

You are making me want to eat bacon now. :9

>I love lists like this, that serve to remind us all that film critics do not get to decide which movies are good and which are bad. Been wanting to do one of my own...

The most a critic can do is give us their opinion. When they start acting like their opinion is fact, then they become obnoxious.
RedReynart
6 years, 10 months ago
The only movies from your list that I watched were, Eagle Eye and The Box.

Eagle Eye, I don't see it as being Sci-Fi nor as Action. Take it for what it is. A Thriller. Do you know that catch phrase they use on Robot Chicken where they parody M. Night? "What a Twist!". Well that is what Eagle Eye is. We don't know who is behind the mysterious calls and why the two main characters are geting them. But it all just BAM hits you in the end with a surprise twist and why the "mystery person" is doing what there doing.. Nothing but a Thriller.  Not the best movie in the world. But heck it was not that bad. Some parts you may laugh at because there awkward in the end but you see it all unfold. Get caught around in the world and well dang..

The Box. Another Thriller that was extrodinarly bazare... Nice concept about what if I push the button, but everything else was really strange and to me had strong undertones to that of religion. Just a button push is sorta an interesting idea but then when we find out more about the man behind the box. It makes you question to, is this god?, Is this the Devil? And how can the guy be doing what he has been doing for so long ? I don't like spoiling a movie but, if ,lightning stuck you, I don't think you will be geting back up with superhuman paranormal abilities. O.o To be it showed off more about the man then the box..
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>We don't know who is behind the mysterious calls and why the two main characters are geting them. But it all just BAM hits you in the end with a surprise twist and why the "mystery person" is doing what there doing.. Nothing but a Thriller.

That's actually a really goddamn good point. I think you've hit upon the central flaw of the movie. If they had simply not made it a twist, and let people know right from the start that this was an AI gone berserk, people would have been much more accepting of a lot of the stuff that does seem preposterous if you assume it's a bunch of people doing it.

>It makes you question to, is this god?, Is this the Devil? And how can the guy be doing what he has been doing for so long ?

I thought it was pretty clear that this was an alien species, testing the human race's suitability to interact with the rest of the universe. They were like humans doing intelligence tests on apes.

>I don't like spoiling a movie but, if ,lightning stuck you, I don't think you will be geting back up with superhuman paranormal abilities.

I think the implication was that the guy died, and then an alien started using his body for, basically, an environment suit.
RedReynart
6 years, 10 months ago
Aliens? XD I must of missed something..  I don't really remember esactly that being said all I know is that when one of the characters was researching him in the library we find out that he has been involed in a freak accident and has been around for quite a long time O.o .. Just that alone is spooky enough But it went from a dark world and a very mysterious figure to something scifi and surperhuman.. (ie: the library and the telepads and such)
Hydrassas
6 years, 10 months ago
I've seen both The Box and Devil, I actually quite liked them both myself and they are really well paced and cleverly constructed... The thing that pisses me off with Hollywood these days in terms of horror films is that they rely on gratuitous violence and a death count with paper thin plots, basically I think Hollywood is just treating us like idiots these days.
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>The thing that pisses me off with Hollywood these days in terms of horror films is that they rely on gratuitous violence and a death count with paper thin plots

ABSOLUTELY YES. I don't mind those kinds of movies, but Hollywood doesn't seem to understand something about them: they aren't fucking scary!! At most, they startle you a few times with jump scares. Horror comes from giving you characters you can like and empathize with, and putting them in situations that delve into the audiences real fears.

I ended up really liking Paranormal Activity, because there was almost no jump scares or CGI stuff (except for the ending, which the studio forced them to add on). It was like horror carved down to its bare essentials. The pacing was excellent. It let the audience imagine all the worst parts (and nothing is scarier than your own imagination). Plus it's a fear anyone can empathize with: not feeling safe in your own home.
Hydrassas
6 years, 10 months ago
" AlexReynard wrote:
>I ended up really liking Paranormal Activity, because there was almost no jump scares or CGI stuff (except for the ending, which the studio forced them to add on). It was like horror carved down to its bare essentials. The pacing was excellent. It let the audience imagine all the worst parts (and nothing is scarier than your own imagination). Plus it's a fear anyone can empathize with: not feeling safe in your own home.


I can agree with that and Paranormal Activity did make a good message very clear, ouija boards are bad news!!! Honestly though they got as much wrong as they got right with it as far as I'm concerned... Yes it's a movie and they have to blow it out of proportion and I'm not criticizing that in the slightest but making the entity as active as it was made me laugh as well as a lot of what it was doing which were put in there to make it scary.

Again I commend the creative thinking based off of what the real things have allegedly done in real cases, honestly though PA was entertaining but it just didn't scare me. That's not to say that if I was in a similar situation myself I wouldn't be scared out of my wits.
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>I can agree with that and Paranormal Activity did make a good message very clear, ouija boards are bad news!!!

I thought this was interesting: You know how Ouija boards work because of unconscious hand movements? We're doing all the work without realizing it? Apparently, that's exactly what they were originally created for! The idea was, you'd buy one and get in touch with what your subconscious was really thinking. I'm not sure where the idea that you could summon demons with it came from.

>Again I commend the creative thinking based off of what the real things have allegedly done in real cases, honestly though PA was entertaining but it just didn't scare me. That's not to say that if I was in a similar situation myself I wouldn't be scared out of my wits.

It scared me some, as a movie with lots of creepy atmosphere, but the idea itself doesn't scare me.
Hydrassas
6 years, 10 months ago
I don't know about it being a door for the subconscious but I can assure you that I will not be using one myself because of my own personal experiences without them.
asuraludu
6 years, 10 months ago
-Freddy Got Fingered
- I have to say you are one of the only people that I've heard that like the movie.  I get what Tom Green was was trying to do, and the way you explained it really makes me want to give it a second look.  When I first saw it, I literally went from "this is cool," to "Ok..... now I'm just bored."  

-Sucker Punch
-  This movie is a mind fuck with a textured BadDragon strap on!  With the right amount of lube and foreplay.  True i saw it with only the giggling desire to see school girl skirts, samurai and zombie nazi.  I did not expect to be drawn into the plot so much as to ignore the special effects scenes and hoping to get back to the real "story."  
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>I have to say you are one of the only people that I've heard that like the movie.  I get what Tom Green was was trying to do, and the way you explained it really makes me want to give it a second look.  When I first saw it, I literally went from "this is cool," to "Ok..... now I'm just bored."  

I admit, a lot of the time I'm enjoying movies on two levels: what I'm seeing on the screen, and also imagining how the movie was made. That's why I sometimes love terrible movies, because it's so much fun trying to picture how the hell such craziness happened. (CATWOMAN!!!) So with FGF, I loved imagining Tom Green very carefully directing each scene to get just the reaction he wanted. It's amazing manipulation if you can spot it.

>This movie is a mind fuck with a textured BadDragon strap on!  With the right amount of lube and foreplay.  True i saw it with only the giggling desire to see school girl skirts, samurai and zombie nazi.  I did not expect to be drawn into the plot so much as to ignore the special effects scenes and hoping to get back to the real "story."

Then congratulations: you are the rare person who met Snyder's expectations. I think a lot of people saw it backwards: 'Who cares about this asylum shit? Get back to shooting orcs with automatic weapons!'

It occurs to me that Snyder was trying to make the action bits just jumbled, unconnected pointless messes of visual excess, thinking that audiences would see that and recognize them for what they were. Unfortunately, he forgot how many people liked Transformers 2...
asuraludu
6 years, 10 months ago
(CATWOMAN!!!)
-  Yeah that movie was a not so guilty pleasure.  I can just picture the director yelling "This is a fight scene darn it!  Be more slutty!"

thinking that audiences would see that and recognize them for what they were. Unfortunately, he forgot how many people liked Transformers 2...
-  I know of that movie from all the media memes, but I'm honestly saying I never sat down to watch it.  Only saw Parts 1 and 3.
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>I know of that movie from all the media memes, but I'm honestly saying I never sat down to watch it.  Only saw Parts 1 and 3.

You really don't have to bother. Aside from a few new characters being added, nothing of consequence actually happens. It ends at virtually the same place the first one ended.
BigD
6 years, 10 months ago
"It shows you the immorality of a system where a few have more than they could ever use, while most are living day to day and dying in the streets."

Perhaps that's why it had to use a false story that would never happen in reality, because that's not the system we have (at least, not to the degree we're supposed to think).
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>Perhaps that's why it had to use a false story that would never happen in reality, because that's not the system we have

I'm just going to have to laugh really hard at that, sorry.
BigD
6 years, 10 months ago
Does the movie address the fact that the government currently controls our money system?  Does it address inflation or manipulation of interest rates?  Are the "rich" all lumped together or are there distinctions drawn between those who get their wealth by productive work and those who get it through favors?

I'm used to people forgetting that a movie like In Time is, above all things, fiction.  Unlike reality, it's not bound by unbreakable laws and the producer can do whatever he wants with it, hence one needs to dissect it and separate fact from fiction.

And I'm open to a debate on the position of our current economic system.  Note that I said it's not like that to the degree portrayed in the movie; I didn't say it wasn't like that period.
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>Does the movie address the fact that the government currently controls our money system?

Pretty much. The movie's equivalent of cops are 'timekeepers', who are far less interested in protecting the people than they are in making sure all the time(money) stays in the castes where it's supposed to be.

>Does it address inflation or manipulation of interest rates?

Also yes. Several times it's mentioned that prices are raised intentionally in the lower class areas to keep them in their place.

>Are the "rich" all lumped together or are there distinctions drawn between those who get their wealth by productive work and those who get it through favors?

Hard to say. Yes, there's really just the one rich guy, and he runs a huge lending institution, which is the kind of non-productive corporation the OWS movement is most angry at. But there's also a scene where the two protagonists steal a rich lady's car. From the way it's shot, you can see it either as them taking back from some rich person, OR that they're being indiscriminate and stereotyping her. The movie is careful enough about blame that it may very well be intentionally encouraging you to say at that part, 'Hey wait, she didn't do anything bad to them.'

>And I'm open to a debate on the position of our current economic system.  Note that I said it's not like that to the degree portrayed in the movie; I didn't say it wasn't like that period.

Okay, fair enough. Though it's also fair to say you made some assumptions about it without having seen it. ;)
Stank
6 years, 10 months ago
Thank you for this list. I would have (and did) skipped a lot of these movies. I'll have to go back and give them a good glance now.

I agree with you about the Matrix sequels. I actually look at them in a way reversed from how you do. I LOVED them when I was younger for all the chances that they took and the heavy philosophical content. Looking back now, however, I can see their failings as films. The alienation and hate they have is well deserved. However I still respect them for those chances they took and the ideas they not only presented, but dove headfirst into with reckless abandon to personal safety.

I also agree about Amityville. The direction is also solid, but like many films at the turn of the century advancements in technology will destroy the very gimmickry it was all founded upon. Which is a shame- with just a little more time and care it could have been a very effective horror flick. That would have made the same amount at the box office. I guess I can *sadly* understand that decision.

The Box is a trainwreck however. Just because all the parts fit together doesn't mean the puzzle as a whole is worth looking at in the end. All the thoughtful stuff you saw in it I found done before, and it simply lacked any frame of reference to make its exceptionally personal journey actually relevant. At least to me. Of course I didn't care for Donnie Darko either.

I'm glad to see you've read as far as you have into these films. Far too many critics are critics by name alone. They are either incapable of thinking deeply into the films because they are trained to relate to your 'average' viewer, view so many en masse, or are simply incapable of doing so. Not every film is given the careful analysis it deserves (given the considerable man-hours put into all of them) because the industry itself seems built around de-valuing its own content to the point of convenient consumerism. 'Freddy Got Fingered' is a cult legend for its unique approach, though I have never heard anybody actually explain WHY to me before. Perhaps even its fans are unaware of its true purpose. I will be watching it for the first time with this in mind, along with Miss March (which I have avoided for fear of seeing respected comedians of mine embarrass themselves).

The bottom line is MANY, too many, films are misunderstood. Cabin Fever comes immediately to my mind, though there are far too many others to list. Films that have other intentions at their core and use genres and expectations as a springboard instead of a cash-in. With everything that comes out it's easy to miss them. I'm thankful you've shown me a few I've missed.

I'd also like to see your list of acclaimed films you disliked, though so help you if 'No Country for Old Men' is on there. 'Cause I'll probably talk about it.
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>Thank you for this list. I would have (and did) skipped a lot of these movies. I'll have to go back and give them a good glance now.

I should point out; with most of these, I can see how someone would really dislike them. But with all of them, I felt like they were disliked for petty or non-applicable reasons. Like with Revolutions, the RotttenTomatoes consensus is: "A disappointing conclusion to the Matrix trilogy as characters and ideas take a back seat to the special effects." Arrrrgh.

>However I still respect them for those chances they took and the ideas they not only presented, but dove headfirst into with reckless abandon to personal safety.

YES. Holy shit. I can't stand movies that are content to be average. I want to see a movie where you can see the effort that went into it. Whether it succeeds or not is almost irrelevant to me. I appreciate the love and commitment that went in.

>like many films at the turn of the century advancements in technology will destroy the very gimmickry it was all founded upon.

Ever heard of a movie called Boogeyman? Horror film I saw at the cheap theaters once. For a while, I was really liking it. It did an excellent job of recreating and examining the kind of fear specific to childhood. And then they went and showed the monster. <forehead slap> It was such terrible CGI, it completely ruined the film. A jacket draped over a broomstick would have been a better villain. If you don't believe something is actually there in the scene, it can't be scary.

>All the thoughtful stuff you saw in it I found done before, and it simply lacked any frame of reference to make its exceptionally personal journey actually relevant.

<shrug> Fair enough. I can enjoy films that say things I've heard before, if they present them in a way I haven't seen. Sci-fi is riddled with 'aliens think humans are fundamentally flawed' type plots. This one seemed less scolding and more genuinely sad about it. And I liked that the husband and wife weren't evil people; suggesting that humanity might genuinely be flawed to its core and it's not even our fault. And even more frightening, we can't do anything about it, even if we're aware of it! I thought it took an old idea and explored it more fully than I've seen before.

>They are either incapable of thinking deeply into the films because they are trained to relate to your 'average' viewer, view so many en masse, or are simply incapable of doing so.

Going by Occam's Razor, I'd guess "view so many en masse". Watching a film when you're in the wrong mood for it can make you cranky. I can't imagine being forced to cram in three or four movies in a night, then review them all to meet a deadline.

>'Freddy Got Fingered' is a cult legend for its unique approach, though I have never heard anybody actually explain WHY to me before.

You're welcome! :)

>Perhaps even its fans are unaware of its true purpose.

I dunno. I figured it out because I watched some episodes of his TV show and saw how good he was at manipulation. There were several bits where he totally screwed with news reporters, leading them where he wanted them like a damn border collie.

>along with Miss March (which I have avoided for fear of seeing respected comedians of mine embarrass themselves).

I don't mind actors I like doing shitty movies, so long as they show some sign that they're aware of it. I genuinely respected Shia LeBeuof for turning in such a thoroughly 'I am contractually obligated and I do not give a SHIT' performance in Transformers 2.

>Cabin Fever comes immediately to my mind

Yaaaay. I liked that too. In general, I think Eli Roth's movies deserve more credit. They're gory trash on the surface, with a lot of clever stuff in the background.

>though so help you if 'No Country for Old Men' is on there.

Naw, I liked that one. A lot of them on my list so far are ones I thought were good, but not great.
Stank
6 years, 10 months ago
For what it's worth I'd rather watch and promote films like 'The Box' over... well just about everything else that comes out of Hollywood. I just don't think it stands up to some of its peers that handle similar such issues. I DID see what you just described in it. It took a slightly skewed result from its theme than similar-such stories, but it wasn't different enough for me to really find it especially thought-provoking. It was... thought-tingling? Thought-suggesting perhaps.

I won't stand behind all of Eli Roth's work (Hostel for instance), but Cabin Fever I feel has a real method behind its madness. Quite literally. I view it as an experiment of sorts, a test to deliberately blur the line between graphic horror and see how far it goes until it becomes comedy... and then push it even further. The whole film gradually escalates to the point of absurdity and then keeps going. Every viewer will reach a stage in the film when their entire interpretation of how to view the film changes, and for every viewer it's a different stage. I find it more of a study in audience reactions and expectations than a horror or comedy film. But most importantly it can also be viewed as a fun film, so long as you can take just a step back while you watch it.

Boogeyman... saw that in theaters. Every moment where somebody ISN'T dying (ie: Special Effects) is good. But Ghost House had a few of those. 'The Messengers' is also a quality horror film- more reminiscent of 'Poltergeist' than Boogeyman's 'Changeling'- until the special effects showcases show up. 'Silent Hill' will always be a brilliant avant-garde possibility doomed by terrible turn-of-the-century computer graphics (and a self-destructive third act).

I always kinda liked Shia LeBouff. He's not GREAT, but he's a decent enough actor and rarely does anything heinous, both in film and real life. I wouldn't be surprised to see him turn into another Leonardo Di Caprio. Not Brad Pitt. Leo. Or maybe Emelio.
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>For what it's worth I'd rather watch and promote films like 'The Box' over... well just about everything else that comes out of Hollywood.

Agreed. An ambitious failure is virtually always more interesting to me than something that's professionally made but pointless.

>I just don't think it stands up to some of its peers that handle similar such issues.

Got any suggestions?

>It was... thought-tingling? Thought-suggesting perhaps.

Fair enough. Like a lot of movies on this list, part of what I liked about it was reading between the lines and trying to imagine what it said about the person who made it.

>I won't stand behind all of Eli Roth's work (Hostel for instance)

I didn't exactly like either of them, but I could appreciate parts of them. The first one had some dark, dark stuff about how Americans view other countries, and in the second one, I got a grin out of how the three main characters ended up.

>I find it more of a study in audience reactions and expectations than a horror or comedy film.

Indeed. I don't like cheap emotional manipulation, but I do like being fucked with by someone who wants me to think.

In Cabin Fever, I also like how the main five are presented at first as the usual, average characters the audience is supposed to relate to. Then gradually, they reveal through their actions that all of them are selfish, awful people. Making you ask yourself, 'I was empathizing with these assholes at first. Would I act any better in this situation? Would I really?'

Also, I love this dialogue:
"Burt, what the hell is that?"
"Huh? Oh, I'm gonna go shoot some squirrels."
"Why would you want to kill squirrels?"
"<beer slurp> 'Cause they're gay."

>But most importantly it can also be viewed as a fun film, so long as you can take just a step back while you watch it.

>But Ghost House had a few of those.

Sounds interesting. The synopsis reminds me of my Ghost Story novel.

>'The Messengers' is also a quality horror film- more reminiscent of 'Poltergeist' than Boogeyman's 'Changeling'- until the special effects showcases show up.

I may watch that. I saw THe Eye and thought it was excellent, though far more sad than scary. Also, why can't studios realize that the best special effects are NOT the ones where your reaction is 'What a great effect!', but the ones where you actually believe what you're seeing?

>'Silent Hill' will always be a brilliant avant-garde possibility doomed by terrible turn-of-the-century computer graphics (and a self-destructive third act).

Saw it. Don't remember it much.

>I always kinda liked Shia LeBouff. He's not GREAT, but he's a decent enough actor and rarely does anything heinous, both in film and real life. I wouldn't be surprised to see him turn into another Leonardo Di Caprio. Not Brad Pitt. Leo. Or maybe Emelio.

I much prefer Leo. When he's good, he's astonishing. Not the usual 'Look how much I want an Oscar!' kind of good acting, but totally vanishing into the role. I first saw him in What's Eating Gilbert Grape and just assumed they'd actually cast a retarded guy. Then I saw him in The Basketball Diaries and had a 'Holy SHIT' moment when I realized it was the same guy.
Stank
6 years, 10 months ago
Oh dear, other films that did 'The Box' better... I know I HAVE seen them, but remembering... The original 'Day the Earth Stood Still' comes to mind. This is talking the... twist of the movie, of course, not the initial concept. Of course The Twilight Zone did that concept before, but that's hardly what 'The Box' is REALLY about. Removing the Science Fiction element there are TONS of films that analyze and judge the human race from a distance and search for its good qualities/where its characters belong in it. There are films that present the world as it is and let the audience interpret as they will (Jacques Tati's films are my favorite, along with 'Koyaanisqatsi' and even modern-day slice-of-life vignettes like 'City of God' that generally don't make a conclusion one way or another about how you SHOULD feel over what you've just seen), and almost any inde film is plotted around the main character making such a decision ('Garden State' being the perfect example there), but as for it being relevant to the plot... that's a bit difficult. Most Sci-Films do it ('In Time,' 'Gattaca,' 'Blade Runner,' 'Never Let Me Go' what have you.) I realize these are all stretches and not EXACTLY like The Box, but to me they cover the same concepts (judging humanity and its impacts, what a human is and should be) and the emotions of individuals involved, and do it with more believable and relateable characters and situations.
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
I've seen quit a few of those and agree with most. Especially the (non-Keanu) Day The Earth Stood Still. On the other hand, what I liked about The Box was how the aliens weren't condescending. You see that all the time. Plan 9, f'rinstance. It was interesting seeing them give us a set of hard tests, and you could tell, honestly hoping we'd pass. It felt like they were being legitimately scientific about it.

I liked too that the movie showed good people giving in to bad impulses. That regardless of the individual, the fault lies in the species. Too often, movies like this paint humanity as monsters, as if we ought to all be ashamed of ourselves. As if the universe would be better off without us. I hate that sentiment. It's both arrogant and lazy. 'Oh, let's be done with the whole mess.' I liked The Box because the conclusion seemed to be that as a species, we're not evil, just still too young to know better. It inspired me to want to be a better person, instead of feeling like, 'Well, we're doomed'. I dunno, maybe my reaction has more to do with me personally than with the movie.
Stank
6 years, 10 months ago
Perhaps. You are right, the whole thing was a lot less black and white than many of my suggestions. And that idea alone is a good one. My problem is the film was far too scattered, incoherent, and inhuman to really capitalize on the idea.
AlexReynard
6 years, 9 months ago
>My problem is the film was far too scattered, incoherent, and inhuman to really capitalize on the idea.

Interestingly, those are qualities that I often like in a movie.

To make an analogy; I finally saw First Blood a few nights ago (figuring that the Rambo films were this huge cultural thing and I might as well give 'em a look to see why). At the end, Stallone gives this amazing monologue where he's hysterical, crying, tripping over words, and a lot of what he's saying is really difficult to make out. And it's so much more powerful and realistic that way. It wouldn't have anywhere near the same impact if every word were enunciated properly. Clarity in this case would be less effective.

How to put this... I'm not saying I dislike brilliantly-constructed movies. But I think failures can be just as important and beautiful and meaningful. When it's not  easy for me to understand what I'm seeing, sometimes I can have a deeper realization while hunting for it, than if the meaning had been clearly spelled out. A bad movie can be like examining an artifact from a different culture. Trying to understand the mindset of the person who created such an unusual thing can be a rich experience. I'm engaged, paying attention, actively participating, instead of passively sitting and watching. To me, a movie isn't like a math problem where you must follow certain steps to get a correct answer. If a film makes me think or feel deeply, that's all I want. I don't care if it does it the 'wrong' way.

Obviously, this doesn't apply to all bad movies. Sometimes, all a movie has to say is 'This studio wanted money and didn't care how they got it'. ;)
Stank
6 years, 9 months ago
I think you're misinterpreting me here. I LIKE that as well. That's far from inhuman. In fact it's the opposite. And by 'scattered' I don't mean 'not conventional,' I simply mean often off-course from its main message. 'Incoherent' is the same thing. Whatever the film meant to say is not coming across as clearly or effectively as it should be. That was my problem with 'The Box.' I don't think it would have worked better if it were more conventional. In fact I think the opposite may be true. If it were less focused on finding physical explanations for things and better facilitated a surreal, emotional journey with acceptance of the fact that things are often beyond what we normal people can understand I think it might have better summarized its point that a human life is a unique amalgamation of decisions and motivations unto itself, functioning in removal from a larger system and thus incapable of being defined in broad summarizing terms with other human lives. Maybe.
AlexReynard
6 years, 9 months ago
>I think you're misinterpreting me here. I LIKE that as well.

I'm honestly not sure if we're actually disagreeing at this point.

>I think it might have better summarized its point that a human life is a unique amalgamation of decisions and motivations unto itself, functioning in removal from a larger system and thus incapable of being defined in broad summarizing terms with other human lives. Maybe.

Funny, I got the exact opposite message from it.
Stank
6 years, 9 months ago
I think it's basic message was 'Well, that's life. Both sides of the film were right and wrong.' So if that's the case we are as well. :3
Shadow3397
6 years, 10 months ago
Nice list!
I completely agree with you on Speed Racer. That movie was awesome on all kinds of levels, but critics seem to miss why. Partly, from my end of things, is because I noticed why the colors and angles and cuts and such are done the way they are.

They didn't make a cartoon into a Live Action movie. No, they made a Live Action Anime! All those bright colors, odd things like parking your car in the living room, the strange camera angles and zip-cuts to others during an action sequence? Those are all staples of anime! They didn't just make Speed Racer as a live action, they kept the anime part of it true to being anime! It's what an anime would look like if it was in real life.
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>They didn't make a cartoon into a Live Action movie. No, they made a Live Action Anime! All those bright colors, odd things like parking your car in the living room, the strange camera angles and zip-cuts to others during an action sequence? Those are all staples of anime! They didn't just make Speed Racer as a live action, they kept the anime part of it true to being anime! It's what an anime would look like if it was in real life.

An excellent point! And if you'd never seen any anime before, I can see how stuff like that would be confusing. Still, I hate it when critics can't separate their personal reactions from how good the movie actually is. 'I didn't understand this! Therefore it's the movie's fault!!' Ugh. I saw one review of Speed Racer I really liked, where the guy was like, 'I don't understand a damn thing in this movie, but I know the future of filmmaking when I see it.'
Feere
6 years, 10 months ago
Do it. Another list.
Shokuji
6 years, 10 months ago
Thanks so much for this list. I'll have to try and watch these if/when I have time. =3

I'd like to see another list if you're able to make it. ^_^
mchollis89
6 years, 10 months ago
I though Revolutions and Speed Racer ROCKED. No Ifs ands or buts. Revolutions was just awesome and a good way to end a story.

And as Speed Racer- Let me just say I'm a TOTAL Cartoon to Movie perfectionist (often to a fault). For who they had, and their costumes, and presentation, I'd say they did a REALLY good job! Granted, they took a few liberties with the gadgets, and another one with the races, themselves. But they kept pretty much everything right where it was. That's the first Anime to movie remake I saw that DIDN'T make me want to bomb Hollywood.
AlexReynard
6 years, 10 months ago
>And as Speed Racer- Let me just say I'm a TOTAL Cartoon to Movie perfectionist (often to a fault). For who they had, and their costumes, and presentation, I'd say they did a REALLY good job! Granted, they took a few liberties with the gadgets, and another one with the races, themselves. But they kept pretty much everything right where it was.

<nod> The total opposite of Transformers. With Speed Racer, they had respect for the original cartoon. And the stuff they changed, it felt like it was for the sake of the story.

>That's the first Anime to movie remake I saw that DIDN'T make me want to bomb Hollywood.

I hope with all my heart that all the protests against the live-action Akira remake will keep it from ever getting made. Although if it absolutely HAS to exist, the Wachowski Brothers are the only people I can think of who might have a chance at doing it right.
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